Are NLS foods really that good?

[Nigel]

since when did fish enjoy a single prepared diet?

The fish shown below have been eating an exclusive diet of New Life Spectrum for 2 years, yet as you can see these fish are anything but, bored of their diet! This is how they react when they see NLS, even after 2 years of eating this food on a daily basis.

Hey, I'm no fish whisperer, but I bet if those fish could speak, they'd say that they are about to thoroughly enjoy their next meal.

We only have your word for that this could be a photo of fish trying to get out of the tank because of the food they are being feed.

[Daniel]

Guys,

This is the most ridiculous topic I have seen in several years on fish forum's. You have a couple of American salesaman constantly trying to drum up their product on a fish forum, and guys like CTThompson who either must be eithe 'retired', or otherwise have joined RD as a shareholder on the Spectrum Inc. share register. Get a load of yourself Craig.

How can one fish food in a pelleted form be good enough for an entire fish diet ? I personally think 'live' food is the ultimate, but this suddenly seems to have changed with this amazing product from the USA call NLS. Can one small American company suddenly come up with a product superior to many years of Tetra, Nutrafin, Hikari etc fish food R & D ?? I highly doubt it.

However, I do believe it is possible to come up with a product that is similar, but for less money, I think this is the market that NLF is looking for. I am sure that in Germany & Europe, many independent food trials have been made over the years and I would not be surprised if NLS does not get a mention over there. I will however say that over the years, I have seen many inferior 'American' products compete superbly against superior German&European products (not fish related) simply because of brilliant 'marketing'. This is where the Americans excel. I have actually tried this NLF stuff a couple of years ago, and did not see any improvement in my fishes colour or behaviour whatsoever.

The bit that really turns me away from this product is Spectrum Inc shareholder R&D who is giving us his/her highly biased marketing propaganda in an attmept to fool many people. The markeing of Pablo's XL marine tank is not going to prove anything whatsoever. I have seen many nicer tanks (and not as overstocked) in Germany, Europe and Japan.

If it wasnt for R & D I might have been tempted to try this product again one time, but I will not bother now.

Go get them NIGEL !!!

[Nigel]

Guys,

This is the most ridiculous topic I have seen in several years on fish forum's. You have a couple of American salesaman constantly trying to drum up their product on a fish forum, and guys like CTThompson who either must be eithe 'retired', or otherwise have joined RD as a shareholder on the Spectrum Inc. share register. Get a load of yourself Craig.

How can one fish food in a pelleted form be good enough for an entire fish diet ? I personally think 'live' food is the ultimate, but this suddenly seems to have changed with this amazing product from the USA call NLS. Can one small American company suddenly come up with a product superior to many years of Tetra, Nutrafin, Hikari etc fish food R & D ?? I highly doubt it.

However, I do believe it is possible to come up with a product that is similar, but for less money, I think this is the market that NLF is looking for. I am sure that in Germany & Europe, many independent food trials have been made over the years and I would not be surprised if NLS does not get a mention over there. I will however say that over the years, I have seen many inferior 'American' products compete superbly against superior German&European products (not fish related) simply because of brilliant 'marketing'. This is where the Americans excel. I have actually tried this NLF stuff a couple of years ago, and did not see any improvement in my fishes colour or behaviour whatsoever.

The bit that really turns me away from this product is Spectrum Inc shareholder R&D who is giving us his/her highly biased marketing propaganda in an attmept to fool many people. The markeing of Pablo's XL marine tank is not going to prove anything whatsoever. I have seen many nicer tanks (and not as overstocked) in Germany, Europe and Japan.

If it wasnt for R & D I might have been tempted to try this product again one time, but I will not bother now.

Go get them NIGEL !!!

Its one thing the North Americans are good at marketing it does not matter how good or bad the product is they will flog it to death untill everyone is convinced its the best product in the world.

[RD.]

Nigel, I have only your word that your name is Nigel. For all I know your name is Sally, and you've hacked into the real Nigel's account.

taybelz - sorry, no pics of Discus handy, although I do know a number of hobbyists in these parts that use NLS as their staple food. (yes, no beefheart!)

Daniel ......

Can one small American company suddenly come up with a product superior to many years of Tetra, Nutrafin, Hikari etc fish food R & D ?? I highly doubt it.

Interesting, and what would be your reasoning to come to that conclusion, Daniel?

Seriously, I'd love to hear it.

Is it so far fetched to believe that one man who has spent a lifetime in this industry is willing to put his money where his mouth is, even if that costs him some points in his profit margin? Sheesh, Pablo is pushing 70 yrs of age, if he all he wanted to do was cash in, he could have sold his company & spent the rest of his days sipping Pina Colada's on the beach.

FYI - the point of showing Pablo's marine tank was to illustrate that even some of the most difficult to keep SW species can thrive on a single high quality food such as NLS. It wasn't a reef set up beauty contest.

As far as marketing, are you guys for real?

New Life spends a teeny tiny minsicule of a fraction marketing this food, compared to the other companies that were just mentioned. Pablo has a 1/3 page advertisement in one magazine (TFH) ...... and that's it!

I believe that he has done one trade show ths past year, maybe two?

He has no marketing reps, and no sales reps.

The companies that you mentioned most likely spend hundreds of thousands of $$$$ on advertising & marketing.

Do I help Pablo out when I can yes, and I have yet to get paid a single penny for doing so.

Some people just can't see the forest for the trees, and that's truly a shame.

[Nigel]

Nigel, I have only your word that your name is Nigel. For all I know your name is Sally, and you've hacked into the real Nigel's account.

taybelz - sorry, no pics of Discus handy, although I do know a number of hobbyists in these parts that use NLS as their staple food. (yes, no beefheart!)

Daniel ......

Can one small American company suddenly come up with a product superior to many years of Tetra, Nutrafin, Hikari etc fish food R & D ?? I highly doubt it.

Interesting, and what would be your reasoning to come to that conclusion, Daniel?

Seriously, I'd love to hear it.

Is it so far fetched to believe that one man who has spent a lifetime in this industry is willing to put his money where his mouth is, even if that costs him some points in his profit margin? Sheesh, Pablo is pushing 70 yrs of age, if he all he wanted to do was cash in, he could have sold his company & spent the rest of his days sipping Pina Colada's on the beach.

FYI - the point of showing Pablo's marine tank was to illustrate that even some of the most difficult to keep SW species can thrive on a single high quality food such as NLS. It wasn't a reef set up beauty contest.

As far as marketing, are you guys for real?

New Life spends a teeny tiny minsicule of a fraction marketing this food, compared to the other companies that were just mentioned. Pablo has a 1/3 page advertisement in one magazine (TFH) ...... and that's it!

I believe that he has done one trade show ths past year, maybe two?

He has no marketing reps, and no sales reps.

The companies that you mentioned most likely spend hundreds of thousands of $$$$ on advertising & marketing.

Do I help Pablo out when I can yes, and I have yet to get paid a single penny for doing so.

Some people just can't see the forest for the trees, and that's truly a shame.

A word of advice Neil dont make it personal or they will delete this post and you and the rest will get barred like you did on that other forum. If you want to state you case do it with out making it personal.

[pablo]

My food for thought; not food for fish.

* My definition on "Expert": An expert is someone who knows so much that he has no room in his head to learn new things.

* Dead fish always follow the current.

* Truth will always withstand the test of time, while falsehood will eventually exposed in the end.

* The good thing about telling the truth is you don't have remember what you said before.

* For some, the world is flat and will always be flat.

[RD.]

Re Discus ..... I forgot that I had this on my website. Old age setting in I guess .......

The photo below was sent to SeaChem by Matthew of Hydro Pacific (current name is

Seachem Australia) and SeaChem sent it to Pablo.

[superlohan]

I have many types of food which I feed my fish, including Tetra, Nutrafin, HBH & NLS.

All these brands have good products but NLS has a consistent amount of great product.

I base my comments on the fact that NLS uses far less cereal fillers than everyone else, instead

using fish/ shrimp/ vegetable proteins etc.

I am a strong advocate of many types of food but if If I was to choose one inparticular it would be NLS

After being advised to use NLS from a friend I have had more fish breed than ever before.

[taybelZ]

Nigel....why do u persist in stirring up this thread....i believe u r on the verge of being banned from this forum as well...then where will u visit during your retirement!!! I know u are having some fun but just let this little vendetta of yours pass, we don't want your BP to get too high mate...your meant to be relaxing....but i guess your enjoying this....We are going to liken u to a guy well known to this forum who is now banned and has started another forum where he has banned RD due to his personal grudge against NLS as well!!!

I don't know why u guys are chucking up so much fuss about this food.....u are responsible for making it so popular, i hope u realise that. I for one, will never stop using the stuff because i have seen the results!

Daniel and Taybelz....it is obvious u guys either keep discuss or other fastidious fish species that require a lot of live foods to keep them satisfied....we don't really care what u think of NLS, u can go on feeding what works with u. I don't think u both should start criticising the food if u both haven't seriously given it a fair go without any bias. U might as well join the guys at a forum I know of who are anti- NLS. But i have seen discus thriving on NLS alone!!!

Thanks Pablo for those words of wisdom....they mean so much if u have the intellect to understand them!!!

Moliro the whole arguement presented is NLS is an exclusive diet , do you know what that means ? Solely and wholely fed! Before you make such ridiculous accusations, perhaps you can state what fish i keep that requires, as you put it lot of live foods to keep them satisfied.

I have never stated not being able to feed NLS to any of my fish, and i believe i have given it a fair go, admittingly with some bias towards its outcomes.

(Its hard not to have some sort of bias to read it and then go out and buy it expecting results, and that is why i have stated if you believe in it you will more likely see *it*, rather then seeing it to believe it.)

Your defamation against name removed is non-constructive nor appreciated...

RD thanks for the photos, those discus look gorgeous!

[kilroy]

OMG 186 replies to this thread Might have to go buy myself some NLS to check it out

[MoliroMan]

u obviously misunderstand the thread, here it is again if u have forgotten "are NLs foods really that good?"

someone has already defined what "exclusive" means so u don't have to reiterate it to me!

i don't think my fish need a "yum cha" sort of diet.....i don't think it is actually the most healthy diet for fish....since u like comparing fish to humans!!!

i use to feed my tropheus osi spirulina only 24/7, 7 days a week 356 days a year and 366 days a leap year!!!

Now i have found NLS to be more superior and use it "exclusively".

Please share with us what exactly u feed to your discus and why do u think it is so good!!!

[waruna]

Hey Neil, beautiful photos mate.

[MoliroMan]

Neil...u didn't mention what those discus were fed on to get them looking so beautiful? beefheart? bloodworms?

[waruna]

For those who think this is the only time that Pablo has posted on a forum:

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtop...mp;&start=0

Pablo doesn't need to promote it, NLS sells itself.

[RD.]

The discus in those pics ate NLS as their main staple, although I am not 100% certain if they were fed NLS exclusively.

Thanks Waruna.

[BaZ]

Nigel....why do u persist in stirring up this thread....i believe u r on the verge of being banned from this forum as well

Who's banning Nigel? Nigel is this something you've arranged without telling me?

Your defamation against name removed is non-constructive nor appreciated...

Hmmm defamation? Some people take this fish stuff way too seriously

Ok taybelZ I've removed the name. Is it now satisfactory?

[Nigel]

QUOTE(MoliroMan)

Nigel....why do u persist in stirring up this thread....i believe u r on the verge of being banned from this forum as well

Who's banning Nigel? Nigel is this something you've arranged without telling me?

I don't know Glenn I was amazed as you where but now that I have taken the knives out of my back I fell much better.

[malrift]

Ok taybelZ if exclusive means the only food fed, I must know what it means because it is the only food I feed from freeswimming to adult fish. Personally I love the food and the results my fish have shown. And I will continue to use pabloes food as it is designed to feed all herbivores, carnivores and omnivores without the need to buy other foods. We aren't telling any one that is not feeding they are wrong but expressing what we have found in feeding this brand of food. I used to feed lots of frozen and live foods but have not found it necessary to do so since feeding exclusively NLS as I am over the moon with the way my fish breed grow and look. After 30 years in the hobby I hope I know what good fish look like and the people I sell too wouldn't keep coming back for more if that wasn't the case.

[MoliroMan]

i finally racked up the courage to pm Pablo and he offered some interesting insight into the topic of exclusive use of NLS for fish.

Here it is:

There are reasons for exclusive feeding as well. You can post this if you want.

Fish nutrition is perhaps the least discussed subject in fish keeping. It is more complicated than meets the eye. In order to produced robust health, all nutrients have to be met in right proportions,such as: Calcium, Iodine, Phosphous, Magnesium, Sodium, Potassium, Iron, Copper, Zinc, Manganese, Selinium, Choline, Carbohydrates, Fiber, Vitamin A, B6 & B12, C, D2 & D3, E, K2 & K3, Pantothenic Acid, Niacin, Biotin, Thiamin, Riboflavin, folic Acid, Myoinositol, Omega 3 & 4, all amino Acids: Arginine, Histidine, Isoleucine, Lysine, Methionine, Phenylalanine, Threonine, Trytophan, Valine. For instance too much Vitamins causes vitamintosis, too little cause poor health. All the elements are intertwined like weaving a basket. All nutrients as energy intake has to exceed energy output, such as locomotion, metabolic function...etc. When energy intake is less than output, the fish slowly waste away until it ceases to exist. Bear in mind, when you feed your fish with variety of food, somehow you "hope" to give them a balanced diet. However, in reality, it is a "guesswork" at best. We have painstakingly experimented to come up with the right proportions to produced heathy fish. The proof of the pudding is in the eating". We have conducted experiments for over 9 years now. We mananged to keep Parrotfish, Angelfish, Surgeonfish, Triggerfish, Butterflyfish...and even some fish like Rock Beauty, Regal Angel, Moorish Idol to name a few, exclusively with NLS. We have yet to encounter lateral line & fin erosion or hole in the head syndrome. We also experimented with Malawi & Tanganyika cichlids and all kinds herbivore, omnivore, carnivore freshwater tropical fish with equal success. This is why our guarantee extends only to exclusive feeding. we know what the fish is getting in their diet with NLS, but we simply can't guarantee other company's food, in most cases we don't even know what is in it? I don't know of any company uses krill & herring as main protein source. krill & whole herring are the most easily digestible protein and the best amino acids profile with added bonus of omega 3 fatty acids. It seem it should be a no brainer to use these ingredients as protein source, but good ingredients cost money and less profit. So, it all boil down to bottom line-$$$$$$. This is only one of the example, I could go on and on... but, I am not going to.

One of the most common objections to the idea of exclusive feeding is that the fish gets bored with one food! This is far from being the truth. Some marine fish in the wild insist of eating very specific food such as coral, coral polyps, sponge, trunicate day in and day out. In captivity, they'd rather die of starvation than switch food! We sometime interject our own feeling into how our fish feel. Terrestial butterfly such as monarch caterpilars will only eat milk weed periord. So are other butterfies, they are all diet spicific. Everyone knows koala bear will only eats eucalyptus leaves day in and day out, Are they bored? you know the answer!

I can sum up my answer with what TFH editor said " Much of scientific wisdom today began as a heresies of another time".

Also for those tropheus nuts out there who are still hesitant to feed NLS to their Ts:

Bloat is not only common in Malawi Cichlids, it is also prevalent in tropheus and many Tanganyika Cichlids. In most cases, fish food is the culprit. Many proteins used in fish food derived from soybean meal and left over seafood such as white fish meal, shrimp meal(ground shrimp head).These types of protein have poor digestability & absorption rate. Consequently, pathogenic bacteria start multifying inside the intestinal tracts, doubling their population every 20 minutes resulting in bloat. The fish usually linger on for a few days before dying. there is another kind non-pathogenic bloat that occurs by feeding too much in the evening just before the light is out. Insufficient oxygen condition for metabolic activity force the fish to gasp for air. The fish usually die the next day with bloated stomach. In my opinion, high level of protein is not the cause for bloat, it is poor digestable protein that is the cause for bloat. How do I come to this conclusion? We use tropheus moorii, a herbivore notorious for bloat, as a test subject. We fed the fish NLS (34% protein) as much as they can eat with lots food left over ( this is an experiment, not normal practice). We never encountered bloat problem in 6 years, In the past, we have lost thousands of tropheus using commercial feed. In my opinion, krill, fish, algae, are the most easily digestable protein. Protein derived from soybean, feather meal, blood meal, left over seafood with too much bones are not easily digestable. Ash content greater than 10% indicates left over seafood is being used.

hth

Dave

Ps...i realise i didn't make it clear, but these are actual replies made by Pablo himself in other forums when these questions were posed to him.

[CThompson]

Guys,

This is the most ridiculous topic I have seen in several years on fish forum's. You have a couple of American salesaman constantly trying to drum up their product on a fish forum, and guys like CTThompson who either must be eithe 'retired', or otherwise have joined RD as a shareholder on the Spectrum Inc. share register. Get a load of yourself Craig.

How can one fish food in a pelleted form be good enough for an entire fish diet ? I personally think 'live' food is the ultimate, but this suddenly seems to have changed with this amazing product from the USA call NLS. Can one small American company suddenly come up with a product superior to many years of Tetra, Nutrafin, Hikari etc fish food R & D ?? I highly doubt it.

However, I do believe it is possible to come up with a product that is similar, but for less money, I think this is the market that NLF is looking for. I am sure that in Germany & Europe, many independent food trials have been made over the years and I would not be surprised if NLS does not get a mention over there. I will however say that over the years, I have seen many inferior 'American' products compete superbly against superior German&European products (not fish related) simply because of brilliant 'marketing'. This is where the Americans excel. I have actually tried this NLF stuff a couple of years ago, and did not see any improvement in my fishes colour or behaviour whatsoever.

The bit that really turns me away from this product is Spectrum Inc shareholder R&D who is giving us his/her highly biased marketing propaganda in an attmept to fool many people. The markeing of Pablo's XL marine tank is not going to prove anything whatsoever. I have seen many nicer tanks (and not as overstocked) in Germany, Europe and Japan.

If it wasnt for R & D I might have been tempted to try this product again one time, but I will not bother now.

Go get them NIGEL !!!

You got to be the biggest idiot I have heard have a rant on ACE. I won’t bother to even reply to your idiotic comments about me, you are not worth the time. I've still got time for people such as Nigel, but you are a waste of time.

Craig

[Nigel]

I've still got time for people such as Nigel, but you are a waste of time.

Craig

Thank you Craig that makes me feel all warm and fuzzy.

Edit: I forgot to add thats a man hug Craig I dont want you to get the wrong idea.

[vwboy53]

It is amazing how people get defensive if their current beliefs are challanged.

It is a given that most, if not all of us, who keep cichlids have had some horrible foods in the past. It is easy to compare NLS with bad foods, and show that NLS is fair superior. But that does not prove that NLS is the BEST food available.

Sure we can all accept that NLS is a good food, there is no question, but you cannot state that it is the best without proof. And when people show photos of their healthy fish and say that it's all because of NLS or NOT NLS, that's not really fair. Many owners are more experienced and dilligent in their care of the fish and their environment than compared with others. I am certain there are many other factors attributing to the healthy looking fish, but it is impossible to label all the benefits are due to NLS.

I firmly believe people should not be so narrow minded on their set beliefs, as new and old things are proven or disproven constantly throughout history. Compare the literature of fish keeping from 30 years ago, to now!

Rob

[Josh]

This is starting to become a good read.

I have nothing to add to this except that it always seems to be the same people plugging this product. I do use NLS and it is a good food, but I wont go into bat for any food. I have seen the results, but I wont get caught up in the hype.

You got to be the biggest idiot I have heard have a rant on ACE.

Thats a big call Craig. There has been a few over the years

[Nigel]

I have nothing to add to this except that it always seems to be the same people plugging this product.

Thats about the most intelligent quote I have read on here Josh and I agree.

[MoliroMan]

Rob.....we are not saying NLS is the best food available, we are saying it can be used exclusively for our fish and from personal experience we are happy with the results. No one is saying it can't be done with other foods. I don't understand where the misunderstanding is? Isn't the thread about "are NLS foods really that good"....don't u think it is reasonable to talk about this product in this thread and share our personal experience?

U can start another thread like Are Omega One foods really that good? or Are HBH foods really that good? Is it going to create so much controversy?

I don't see a problem with defending a product we believe in....who said we can't do that? U don't have to read the post if u don't agree! The last time i checked it was still an open forum?