mitch barlo Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 g'day all today i have put my female salousi in a breading net, she has been holding for 16-18 days, should i leave her in the breeding net (and rish her eating them before i get to her) or attempt to strip her. also could any one fill me in about what to do when stripping a fish/how to do it? cheers mitch.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TropheusQueen Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 Hi Mitch, You will find a couple of schools of thought on the stripping of fish as there is a belief that females stripped will not ever hold to term as the behaviour does not imprint. I have allowed females carry to term when the room is available to seperate them from the colony and have also stripped when required. My experience has been that stripped or not, females will proceed to carry to term if left naturally. To minimise your fry loss you will need to seperate them from mum as she will be hungry after the event....having said that my saulosi tend to be ok with their fry as long as there are alot of hiding spots . To strip the fish ensure that you have enough water in the container to cover the female then: Wet your hands thoroughly. Gently hold the fish and using a cotton bud open her lower jaw..the cotton tip will grip on her tiny teeth. The fry should start to emerge. Repeat the process a few times if needed, but remember to immerse her fully in the water every 5 - 10 sec. to enable her to breathe. Try to keep a loose grip on her as you do this, as she may pick up the fry again if left to free swim. Finally do a check of her mouth to ensure all fry have been removed. If left holding even one she will not eat and recover as quickly. The choice is yours...letting them spit naturally is ideal, but not always possible. Keeping the welfare of the fish in mind is paramount, so if you are reluctant better to err on the side of the fishes safety. Hope this helps. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sicj Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 Well what i do with my fish when i milk(REFERING TO GETTING THE FRY OUT OF THE FEMALES MOUTH) them is that i get a bucket, fill it with the same tank water so that i can put the fish and my whole hand in when needed. Then i catch the female up wet my hands so i donot damage the fishes slimy coating. Then i hold the fishes head between my thumb and my pionting fingers and rest the fishes body in my palm. then with my other hand i i open the fishes mouth and sort of dunk her head in and out of the water and most of the fry should come out. Sometimes people like to use toothpicks to open the fishes mout but i havent tried this b4. Also if you can get all the fry and there are only a couple left in there dont worry about it as you can stress the female out to much in trying toget these fry out. Hopfully you have luck, if you have any other questions plz dont hesitate to pm me so i can help you out I have milked frontosas to leptosomas so i have a bit of experience good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducksta Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 Mate, I doubt you have "milked" frontosa and leptsoma's as milking involves conditioning the fish and then "squeezing the gut" so all the eggs get laid into a trough, then doing the same with a male for its milt, like in salmon farming. What we are talking with mouthbrooding cichlids is termed "stripping" and is quite different. I am with Aline on this. I generally only strip if I have to, like if the fish has lost too much condition, or have spat most of the eggs/fry in a net already, I then strip the last few rather than make her lose condition for 3-4 weeks for a couple of fry. Usually I let my females spit into a fly net or ice cream floaty, and they never seem to eat them. At least my yield is always such that I don't care if she had eaten a few. Ideally I would like to let them spit in a heavily planted/rocked 18"-2' tank. but I just don't have that many 2' tanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitch barlo Posted July 1, 2004 Author Share Posted July 1, 2004 yiiieeeeew ... thanx heaps Chipimbi i did exactly what you said and successfuly stripped all of the fish she was holding there is about 15 or so of them took about 10 mins to get them all out, thanks again for you advice .. thanx for your post sicj but i am new to this hobby and chipimbi's technique sounded i bitt safer. thanx guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducksta Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 10 minutes? Seems unbelievably excessive to me. I know it was your first attempt, but your fish will feel the effects all the same. I wouldn't want to be handling the fish for more than 30 seconds to a minute, although I never sat a watch beside myself. You will need to work on your technique to reduce the stress on the females. Either that or make the decision to let them hold full term in future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parrdog Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 Hey Ducksta, Get up on the wrong side of the bed this mornin' mate. Comments like these aren't necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitch barlo Posted July 1, 2004 Author Share Posted July 1, 2004 just one more question, how often should i feed them, duskta- it probally took me so long because i only had her out of the water no more then about 5 secs then gave her time to rest in the water for a while before i did it again- dont know if this was right or wrong but it worked and the female is swimming around like nothing ever happened, so thats all i care about. thanx for your reply Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 Mitch, It took me ages the first time I did it. Now it seams quick and easy. With then fry be carefull if they have gone intp the breeding net. If there are other fish in the tank, they may attack the fry from below the net Try to make up some sort of fry saver if possible josh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitch barlo Posted July 1, 2004 Author Share Posted July 1, 2004 thanx mate sounds like a good idea . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 G'day The process of holding onto the eggs tends to knock the ladies around a little and we like to keep them away from 'dad' until their condition returns to normal. Just feed her as you normally would. I would suggest though that you give her good quality food, including protein pellets and also some vegie foods. Some zucchini wouldn't be out of order either. Goodluck and congrats. cya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sicj Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 Hey ducksta i wasnt refering to milking as in what you are talking about i was talking about as in getting the fry outta the females mouth ok. So dont go jumping to conclusions buddy. Hey ducksta i think you gotta watch the way you talk to people because what you said to me was unfair and i might of used the wrong term but i know what i was talking about ok. So in future if you not gonna say anything nice dont say it at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gutty Posted July 1, 2004 Share Posted July 1, 2004 Hahahaha........the newbie giving you a hard time Duck ?? sicj, with posts like that you won't go too well around here. Ducksta happens to be a long time member and very well respected one at that. I think it's quite obvious he knows what he's talking about and you don't. Maybe have a think about pulling your head in a bit.............Ducksta shouldn't have to tip toe around your lack of knowledge(wether it be fish or the english language) for fear of upsetting you. That's YOUR problem, not his. Mitch, can you tell me why you had to strip them ? I'm very curious of your reasoning, as i've only ever had to strip one female in the last 6 years. Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sicj Posted July 2, 2004 Share Posted July 2, 2004 Hey i am only trying to help here i am not trying to be stupid or start any fights i am only trying to help out. I dont have to be put down by people. And if they do have more knowledge well why dont they share it in a proper way. I also know that i dont have a lack of knowledge, i might not have been on the forums for long but i have been keeping cichlids for ages Anyway i would like to forget about all this and just move on cause i am not a bad person, all that i try to do is help out people so that they can minimise the problems that they have with there fish and so on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitch barlo Posted July 2, 2004 Author Share Posted July 2, 2004 thanx sicj for all of your advice it was acurrate and very helpfull gutty- i stripped her because if i left her in the breeding net and she had spat them without me knowing, there is a chance that she might eat them... settle down as well, guezz all sicj did was give some advice.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazimbwe Posted July 2, 2004 Share Posted July 2, 2004 Hey ducksta i wasnt refering to milking as in what you are talking about i was talking about as in getting the fry outta the females mouth ok. So dont go jumping to conclusions buddy. hmmm...what you were refering to is "Stripping". What you said you were refering too is "Milking". As these two things are entirely different, and as you were replying to a Newbie, maybe taking the time to ensure the accuracy of your post would be a good thing.? Also I hope to heaven that you did-not/will-not/do-not tell anyone how to strip Cyps. Furthermore, I am hoping you never do it again. You may have succeeded at this but it is a highly dubious thing to do with fish whos jaw is structured in the way the Cyps is. Hope you will not be offended by anything I have said...but Ducksta is on the mark, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sicj Posted July 2, 2004 Share Posted July 2, 2004 Any time mate i am here to help and still learn alot myself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducksta Posted July 2, 2004 Share Posted July 2, 2004 Wow, didnt mean to offend anyone with either of my posts, like everyone else was trying to help. sicj, was correcting you for the sake of correctness. Had somebody tried a google search for milking a fish and not know it was entirely different, imagine the results had they then turned around and milked their frontosa Mitch, was simply saying that 10 minutes of you playing with the girl would have been highly stressful. And I stick by this. Even though you only had her out of the water and in your hands for sporadic short bursts, I don't think it is optimal. Like everyone has said though, it gets easier, and you will get better/faster. The best I have seen on the strip is Lungy in QLD, he had a female moorrii netted, removed and stripped of 60+ eggs in under 45 seconds when I was at his place. He is a freak. Shame he is such a serial rule breaker on forums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicious Camel Posted July 2, 2004 Share Posted July 2, 2004 The best I have seen on the strip is Lungy mmmm........ not something i'd really like to see myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitch barlo Posted July 2, 2004 Author Share Posted July 2, 2004 ducksta- thanx for your help with this topic, i also agree that 10 mins would have been a bitt to stressfull for her, so thanx for giving your opinion and next time i can try do it a bitt quicker to reduce the stress.....60+ in under 45 secs what a freak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted July 2, 2004 Share Posted July 2, 2004 you have to remember that saulosi have a pretty small mouth aswell, probably not the best fish to learn on Josh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitch barlo Posted July 2, 2004 Author Share Posted July 2, 2004 yeah, the salousi's are the only ones in my tank breeding, so i guess ill learn the hard way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TropheusQueen Posted July 3, 2004 Share Posted July 3, 2004 Hi all, I always know the minute I resond to a post like this that it will generate controversy - but I do it every time when a newbie expresses a need for assistance. I think that we are all learning still and if your education in fish husbandry is complete I would really love to meet you. As mentioned earlier the stripping of fish is an individual decision and one that I don't take lightly but dependant on circumstance. Regardless of the size of the fish, I have found it can be done safely and as humanely as possible. Ducksta was spot on, as were a few other responses, however carefully the written word is penned - the tone is always open to interpretation and everyone has to cope with that one on a public forum. My disappointment comes from the lack of constructive direction given to alot of our new hobbyists thats all - interpret how you will. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted July 3, 2004 Share Posted July 3, 2004 Guy's I think you all need to use some emoticons to let people know the tone in which to take your post. If you don't then we may have to start removing your posts. See what I did there.... without the addition of a wink and a cheeky tough I am sure some of you would have bitten. The odd emoticon here and there my have prevented such a simple question and answer turning into a contest of who can get away with what till a mod steps in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gutty Posted July 4, 2004 Share Posted July 4, 2004 gutty- i stripped her because if i left her in the breeding net and she had spat them without me knowing, there is a chance that she might eat them... settle down as well, guezz all sicj did was give some advice.. Settle down ??? Hahahaha You're kidding right ?!?! What makes you think the mum would eat them ? If she was going to eat them why would she bother holding them in her mouth for weeks ? Believe it or not these fish are pretty good at breeding all by themselves. Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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