patchy Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 i'm looking into canisters for a 5x1.5x1.5 or 400L and i'm stuck between going absolute quality or absolute theory, in other words i'm stuck between an Ehiem proIII or 2 aqua pro 1500lph filled with ehiem media. The stats of both of them are... Pro III 1700lph with filter volume of 13L thus ratio of 130lph per L of filter volume manufacture's recommendation 1200L aquarium Aqua pro (2) + eheim media 1500lph with filter volume of 7.22L (volume baised on Eheim 2028 correct me if wrong) thus ratio of 207lph per L of filter volume manufacture's recommendation 600L aquarium (i have not factored in that i am using 2) i consider the lph to filter volume ratio as an indication of a filter's efficiency, if you want to hear my justification then you may ask. i would like to buy the pro III because of it's high effieciency both as a filter and electrical bill-wise as well as having lots more gadgits but the difference in price as well as reduce risk of knocking out all the bacteria at once is very tempting indeed. i'd like any input on this, opinions, other theory's or personal experiences with filling cheapo-eheim copies *cough aqua pro cough* with eheim media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markus13 Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 At the end of the day, you get what you pay for. And considering you can now get your hands on a Pro III 2080 for less than $650 retail, I would be going with the eheim for sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wui39 Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 Like in some previous threads there seems to be some arguement as to the Lph vs filter media size. Personally, I have the 2028 and the Aqua Pro CF1200. Not exactly the same but pretty close. I would say that both filters work. Both do the job of cleaning the tank so no complaints there. Pros of the Eheim: 1. Feels rock solid 2. Awesome inlet and output fittings 3. The "push to prime" actually works 4. Come with all the media (not sure abut the ProIII though) 5. Ultra quiet 6. Parts support 7. Long warranty Cons of the Eheim: 1. Damn expensive even when on sale 2. In some cases your limited to using Eheim filter pads Pros of the Aqua Pro: 1. Cheap, cheap, cheap like 1/3 the price of an equivalent Eheim 2. Good flow rate 3. Fairly quiet not as quiet as the Eheim but you would be hard pressed to tell further than 1m away Cons: 1. Dodgy media (You are basically forced to replace) 2. "PTP" doesn't work as well as the Eheim, have to manually start the siphon or else the filter won't suck Yes filling with Eheim media improves the "copies" and the 2 filters will give you a backup in case one fails. Personally, Eheim has worked for me and the Aqua Pro I bought was for trial and because it was damn cheap from Ben. I would only buy the Eheim in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cobaltcraig Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 Hi Patchy there are to costs involed setup cost Eheim will be more and then there is running cost I am sure that the other filter will chew more power filters run 24/7 So depending on how long you plan to keep the tank will depend on what you save cheers craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 The Cheapies use 40w each, what does the Eheim use? (Seriously, I can't find it listed anywhere) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve24cro Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 id go 2x aqua pro for sure, eheim are over priced by 1000% for 650 bucks you can get 9 aquapro 1500s. They might not 'feel' as good, but damm i wouldnt waste your money. I dont know why ppl like throwing away hard earned cash but hey each to their own as i say. You cant say that eheim 2080 is 9x better. it might be 2x better, but eheims dont justify their immense price. There is nothing at all wrong with cheaper filters like aqua pros, aqua ones, i have used aqua ones for years, never had a problem, always run very well. Plus the media pack for the 2080 retails for $199 so total cost is $850, thats just crazy if think about it logically. Your fish dont know if your running a eheim or some cheap chinese brand, as long as the filter works, thats all that matters. Unless your made of money, id go 2x aqua pro 1500s. Just an opinion, i know everyone will tell me im wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 Personally, I'd make a sump & have 4-5x more media area & ~4000lph running through it chewing more power than the eheim but less than the two cheapies & costing similar to the two cheapies to setup & outfiltering all 3 put together. /Flamesuit on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cobaltcraig Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 eheim pro 3 = 30watts hope that helps cheers craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wui39 Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 Personally, I'd make a sump & have 4-5x more media area & ~4000lph running through it chewing more power than the eheim but less than the two cheapies & costing similar to the two cheapies to setup & outfiltering all 3 put together. /Flamesuit on ← He would have to drill the tank then............unless he already has a weir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 meh, still way less money than an eheim. you don't need a weir anyway, standpipe will do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leungie Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 I have the same problem too, I am planning to use the Fluval 4 plus internal filter + a eheim (2217 or 2028). (4x2x2) and add another canister if needed later. How much would it cost to fit a sump filter? Seems like so much hassles to fit it isn't it? Since I've already got fish in my tank (going to be a geophagus tank). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scienceman Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 I have a 6' X 18" X 20", 400L display tank that I set up 14 months ago. I chose the Eheim Pro II 2028 for efficiency of biological filtration, ease of cleaning/priming, quietness and reputation. This was fine for a new tank with all young small fish, but I have found that with a heavily stocked (~30 fish) tank of large fish there is an increased need for mechanical filtration than provided by the 2028. I bought a Fluval 202 a few months ago and filled it with filter mat material. While this has improved the removal of large and fine waste, it cloggs withing a few weeks and growth in the tubing reduced the flow rate too much. Tomorrow I'm buying a 2nd hand 404 which should prolong the time between cleaning and give better flow for that time. I now intend to put a coarse filter mat at the top of the Eheim so that it does not have to be opened very often for cleaning and just use the 404 to remove solids. It is not necessary to buy the Eheim filter mats which are single use only as they fall apart when dirty. I have purchased sheets of the white mat which can be cut to size and cleaned / reused many times. So, I think you want to consider in your equation, what number and size of fish you intend to stock and whether you intend to separate your biological from mechanical filtration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D6C1 Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 Hmmm Interesting indeed. I got Ehiem and a pro aqua.. The pro aqua has flimpsy taps. I would rather pay the extra $$ and have peace of mind that a tap would break while I am away or suddenly have the hose come off etc.... I have set up both filters in a way that I dont have to touch the pro aqua that often at all... Each to their own. Fish dont know what filter you are running, but you do. It comes down to your situation. If the cheapy chinese brand breaks, what have you got back you up untill you buy another? How expensive are your fish and how big is your setup? How fast would your system go down if say your filter breaks when you leave home in the morning and you come back at 6pm. Just some thoughts :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parrdog Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 I bought my new tank about 18 months ago. When I got it I decided against a sump since I had a couple of canisters ready to go. Since then I have replaced one with an Eheim, and then added another Eheim. I could have actually got a sump from the beginning and it would have been cheaper. The canisters do a fine job, but I HATE the look of all the unsightly intake tubes and heaters, which wouldn't be there if I opted for a sump. Also I could have customised the flow rate better. Almost everytime I look at my tank, I wish I got that sump. Hopefully one day I'll change it over, but I doubt it, it would be a massive job. Of course if you are considering doing a planted tank, a sump isn't desirable. Just my experience, Jamie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unnatural_Selector Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 I'll add my 2 bob.. I'm running 3 Pro Aqua cannisters, never had a problem, very quiet and the auto-prime works fine every time for me. Should also be said Ive never used a brand name cannister either so I can't compare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parrdog Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 Better give some info on canisters. I have Eheims, a Via Aqua (now Aqua One) and a Fluval. The Eheims have been the best by far, followed by the Fluval, then the Via Aqua. All still run fine by the way, just never have any probs with the Eheims, they run flawlessly for me. Jamie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve24cro Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 well i dont think eheims are worth anywhere close to their inflated price tags,like the 2080, worth maybe $300 max, anything more and thats insane. If your cheap and nasty filter breaks down, its not a catasrophe, example, i accidentally left both of my filters off on my tank (heavily stocked) for 2 full days when i was changing the water. No fish died. That was 2 full days, Fish generally wont die from a lack of filtration that fast, i had air stones running and that is what saved my fish. I love how everyone always says 'ive never had a problem with an eheim' well for that price tag it better last 20 years without a problem. Ive run 2 cheap canisters for 5 years on a tank, never had an issue. I guess if you take care of the filter, even a cheapo will last ya a long time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parrdog Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 My Eheim 2217s were $220, I think that's pretty good value. My other canisters have been running for many years (Via Aqua and Fluval), so yes they do a good job, just not as good as Eheim as far as annoying little probs go. Jamie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patchy Posted January 18, 2006 Author Share Posted January 18, 2006 lots of thanks for the quick reply guys I've considered a sump but the cabinent is seperated into 2 sections and individually they are way too small for a sump and i'm not too keen a drilling, maybe my next tank... (do i hear MTS talking?) right now the cheapest i've found the proIII for is 800 including media. For the aqua pro's it's $140 for both 2L of ehifimech $35 (might just use the ceramic noodles that come with it) 8L of ehfisubstrat pro $200 DIY filter wool and pads which i already got in total its $400 max for the aqua pros including media... is it just me or is this figure getting more tempting by the minute? i've thought about the reliability issues and effectivness and i reckon it all balances out in the end, pros and cons all end up canceling out each other. however one thing is still bugging me, a question for those intune with energy bills. Will 80W vs 30W end up paying itself over the course of around a year? if so then i think i will go the ehiem as i will end up paying the same amount if not more in time, assuming this tank will be running for a long time. the tank will be medium stocked with SA cichlids or a colony of geophagus with little or no plants, again if i can get the money together for the geo's . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 Um, have you considered hang on back's for mechanical at all? an AC300 is ~1100lph & only 5w!! Combine that with a cheaper Eheim model with about 1000-1200lph & have a more power efficent & reliable setup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 I think 1W=$1 per year. Someone will shot me down if I am wrong. Ehiems are great filters, no arguement from me, but if you are doing it on a budget get the cheapies. It is very unlikely both will break at once and that alone is a backup that one ehiem can give you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E4G13M4N Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 I agree with the you get what you pay for, if you are on a tight budget go the cheap. I have Eheims between 2 and 15yo still running and had a couple of the old fluvals that lasted 10 years. (I dont think the new Fluvals will last as long as the old ones ) I have tried a few of the cheap brands over the last 6 years only 1 has lasted more than 3 years so far because parts always breaking mainly taps and top clips and impeller covers. In the end hated cleaning the dam things as you never knew if it would be a goer once cleaned. Besides waiting so long for some of the parts to actually arrive at times or having to modify them while waiting for them after a year or 2 they are more of a annoyance than a blessing IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 Littled Swimmer, I can confirm that 1w = approx $1 per year when being run 24/7. Well that is the rate in Sydney currently, rural areas will be slightly more. I recall someone once saying that Adelaide is atleast 30% more than this ? So 80w vs 30w = $50 - $60 saving per year for most people. If you have the cash, then Eheim's are the smart buy as you will eventually get your money back. Buy your Eheim in Singapore or the US and will be much cheaper. Who ever said that you have to buy genuine Eheim media ? Trans Aquariums sell Eheims and have options for non Eheim media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ndoboi Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 Buy your Eheim in Singapore or the US and will be much cheaper Only problem with buying electrical gear from the US is it will need a power converter (step down from our 240V to 110V). I think Singapore gear is the same V (or close enough...) but will need a plug adapter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wui39 Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 240V or 220V can anyone actually guarentee what voltage your actually getting these days? If you run a UPS then the answer is probably yes (and then even certain UPS's don't even put out a "proper" Voltage) Anyone notice when EA switched over to 230V? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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