Jalo reef

[sam.apo]

I went to the nswcs meeting and chose these jalo reef fish from a winning ticket in the raffle. There was 4 fish in the bag. This is the last 1, it was swimming around fine about 2 hours ago. All the other fish are fine the only fish that have been dying is the jalo reef 1 at a time. Their not bloated havent been beaten up and the water parameters are good. Were these fish just duds? or do these fish have special needs?... i was really hoping these fish would grow up i liked the look of them..

[sam.apo]

I also got a bag of red top zebras.. all 5 of them are still doing well...

[Link2Hell]

Hi Sam

I can't understand why this has happened with the fish

I had them for 3 weeks at my place before they were taken to the raffle feed NLS

and they were fine with the other fish Kadango borleyi that also went to the raffle

and some Geo steindachneri that I still have in the tank

pH is approx. 7.8 don't know hardness as I add buffer when I water change weekly

and tank has coral rubble mixed into substrate

fish were sourced local and fish from same batch were sent to Pleco Sam in Townsville

I haven't had any comment of problems with them since they were picked up by him

more than that I can't add about them

I feel they don't require any different treatment to any other Malawi hap

when did you start loosing them ?

[sam.apo]

Link2hell thanks for the reply.

I noticed within the first few days these fish were not eating always hiding and just hovering at the bottom of the tank. Not swimming with the other fish and just generally not happy. I lost the first 1 approximately a week after.. then 1 every week or two untill now. I change water every week and check the parameters. The tank is .. lightly stocked about 25 ..3-5cm fish. 6x2x2 with a sump ..

[Link2Hell]

Hi Sam

I'm guessing that the tank has been running a while and filter is established,

other than that if they may have chilled by sitting on the floor the night you got them

or they have had a reaction to the water parameters that may be different to what I

had them in

had no problem with them eating when they were here

[Buccal]

Going from hard to neutral water can have similar effect.

Or pre-subjection to ammonia,,, (in transit bags).

[PlecoSam]

The Jalos are all fine up here, my water is buffered and hardened through added salts though.

[sam.apo]

Thanks for the replys every one.

Sounds like these things just happen. Could be a dozen different possibilities... but... i need to replace them can you point me in the right direction

[sorroz]

There is always a reason ..not always obvious tho.

It will help a lot if you can supply what the actual water test results are

as it is possible that what you may consider acceptable actually is not.

Kevin

[sam.apo]

I just tested now ..i didnt take a photo nitrate 0 ammonia 0 ph ph about 7.4 ill test again when i get home late tonight n post a photo

[sam.apo]

I think i have a problem with phosphates... and green algae but i dont have a test kit

[PlecoSam]

Linky sourced them for me, good kid that one!

[sorroz]

Ph is low do you know what the hardness is ?

[sam.apo]

No idea what the hardness is [emoji23] im a first timer.[emoji16] what test kit do I need for that? I have heaps of holey rock in the tank n crushed coral in the sump for ph how do i raise it more.

[Donny Brasco]

with a buffer like seachem cichlid salts, tech dens rift lake conditioner or there is a tone of other stuff on the market as well that will all raise and stabalise your ph, gh and kh

I personally use a combination of the rift lake conditioner, sea salt, epsom salt and bicarb soda and i use prime as a dechloranator/ ammonia buffer when doing water changes.

[sam.apo]

All ive ever put in is macropore n a phosphate pad in the sump

[Buccal]

Get yourself seachem buffer and a GH KH test kit mate,, number one thing.

Your ph is low 7's which indicates likelyness a KH of 5-6 which is way low, even 7 to low in general.

You need buffer to raise KH to 12 at least. (minimum).

Your ph will then automatically raise to 8.4-8.6.

With good buffers like seachem,,, you'll get a good balance of GH and KH together once buffer is used.

Now,,, you do know that if your fish are put in bags or bucket for transport,,, then if there's no pump airation, the oxygen slowly depletes obviously as it gets used up by fish.

This believe it or not (as long as its not dangerously low) lowering oxygen is a good thing,, as the ammonia molecules cannot bind to oxygen molecules as much which is how it enters the fish.

Ammonia binds to oxygen, fish breathe oxygen,,, oxygen becomes low then less ammonia transference into fish.

When fish get to your house, if you empty bag water into bucket and airate it with fish in it,,,, BANG !!!!!!, the built up ammonia binds to newly transferred oxygen and fish get blasted with it.

Lots of ammonia lock in bags really help a lot.

Some people use prime or the likes of,, but it only has about 20% of the effect that ammo lock has.

Prime locks other stuff as well like nitrite and nitrate.

But ammo lock is ammo specialized for ammo only.

I put bag water with fish in bucket and put 3 x that amount of my tank water in,,, let it sit for ten mins, then dump,the fish in.

That's what I meant with ammonia burn,,, it's very sudden to.

[sam.apo]

This stuff or a different 1

[sorroz]

Unfortunately it does seem that we have at least found out why the deaths have occurred.

The fish have come out of higher Ph and Hardness and slowly died from being placed in

the wrong water chemistry for them .

We all make the same sort of mistakes in the beginning and have to learn the hard way .

Get your self a test kit and test the water hardness ,if you do not add any sort of hardness generator and

you live in Sydney area the tap water is very low hardness and totally not suitable for Malawi or Tangs.

If you do get a buffer to increase the Ph and hardness ..remember to only do the increases very slowly over a long period

or you will most likely kill all the other fish with the shock .

Always remember if in doubt or you don't know ask on one of the forums and someone will help you out .

Kev

[sam.apo]

Thanks guys id say you have quite possibly solved this 1. I will head down to my lfs and pick up something. Your knowledge and advice is greatly appreciated.

Thankyou.

[Buccal]

Yes, called PH shock.

The drastic change off hardness and PH, can effect fish greatly.

The drastic change may not necessarily effect all fish all the time, as variables are also present.

You could do the wrong thing 5-6 times and get away with it, then a more delicate bunch of fish fall victim.

Your looking at salts and not buffer.

Here is a over view below that should allow you to become clear on what's what.

Malawi/Victoria Buffer

Product Description

Malawi/Victoria Buffer™ is a blend of carbonate salts designed to enhance the natural environment of cichlids by increasing hardness, buffer capacity, and pH. It is formulated to maintain a pH of 7.8–8.4. For optimum replication of the Malawi/Victoria environment, use with Cichlid Lake Salt™ and Cichlid Trace™.

Sizes: 300 g, 600 g, 1.2 kg, 4 kg, 20 kg, 100 kg

Directions

Use 5 g (1 level teaspoon) for each 40–80 L (10 to 20 gallons*) of water each day until desired pH is attained and maintained. Thereafter, use as required to maintain pH, usually no more than once every two to three weeks. TIPS: It is best to dissolve the buffer in freshwater before use. Use when setting up an aquarium or making water changes (preferably after the addition of Seachem’s Cichlid Lake Salt™) and between water changes as needed to maintain pH. Seachem’s Malawi/Victoria Buffer™ is formulated to maintain a pH between 7.8 and 8.4, depending on the amount used. To attain a lower pH than 7.8, you may use Seachem’s Acid Buffer™ in combination with Malawi/Victoria Buffer™. To attain a higher pH than 8.4, use Tanganyika Buffer™.

[sam.apo]

Ok so i went to my LFS and did a water test ph 7.2 ..kh 5 .. so they sold me these..

[Buccal]

My guess on KH was right then....

You dont need the barley straw,,,, they sold you a whole heap of stuff there lol.

You'll need to read the instructions on bottles as to what they do.

Most people like myself will be unfamiliar with these product brands.

But seachem riftlake buffer is great stuff.

Just dose your tank teaspoon by teaspoon and keep count.

Disolve in warm water and dose tank to save time,, wait a few minutes between doses till testing.

Once you have number of teaspoons taken,,, then if you do 1/3 water changes, divide by 3 and that's how much every water change to add.

If 50% water changes then divide by 2.

If your product is close to seachem, I'd be guessing6-7 teaspoons to get your 6x2 to 12kh which will be roughly 8.2 ph.

[Skippy]

If you have fish in the aquarium you need to raise your pH and hardness slowly. Raising the levels quickly will have a negative effect on your fish.

[Buccal]

^^^. That's the advice I dish out also.

Personally In the past I've just raised it in a few hours to where it needs to be.

The fish sulk or half hour or so,,, then come good.

Their happiness in higher KH is very noticeable to my eye.

Increments of ph is not how most people think it is,,,,,, a ph of 7 compared to a ph 8,,, the ph of 8 can be 7-10 x more stronger than the ph of 7.

A sudden change of increased KH PH is not as bad as sudden change of decrease heading towards acid.

Just like a sudden increase in the temp is not as bad as a decrease.

So as Skippy suggested raise your KH slowly,,, at most 2 increments of KH daily or every second day.