Kazaf Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 I put some activated carbon into a carbon bag designed to put activated carbon in.. when i run the filter a little bit of the black water comes out from the carbon or charcoal. is this safe? is the black water toxic?welll you cant see it, just making sure for the safety of my fish.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Miller Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 The blck water is just carbon dust - it won't harm your fish. But if you are worried just give the bag a quick rinse under the tap before you put the bag into the filter. And remember to replace the carbon after 6 weeks - otherwise it can start releasing all the nasties back into the water. Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MollyMan Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 Carbon should only be used to remove meds, odours, or discolouration in the water, and at best, it is only in its active state for about 3-7 days, after that it is simply a biological host... Another thing to note, carbon should be rinsed thoroughly prior to being placed in the filter as any carbon that is still in its dry state deprives the water of its oxygen content, which can affect the well being of your fish... although not a huge risk, it is something to be mindful of... Personally I would try and resist using carbon unless absoloutely necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Miller Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 Whereas I use carbon in all my tanks all the time with no appreciable problems. Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MollyMan Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 Whereas I use carbon in all my tanks all the time with no appreciable problems In that case, it would be a lot cheaper for you to use ceramic rings, or cintered glass, as carbon is useless after a few days other than being a host to bio-bugs... ...also, studies have concluded that carbon is unlike ammonia absorbants, it doesnt leech any waste, as once it is not in its active state, it is the same as any soft & porrous mineral... you would be doing yourself a huge favour, and creating a more stable aquatic environment if carbon was only used for its intended purpose... just a heads up, which may save you some $$$ and time when it comes to maintenance... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Miller Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 Hi The following are extracts from a couple of articles on activated carbon (AC) which suggest that its use is beneficial. The first article is on the use of AC for filtering drinking water and the second on using AC in marine aquariums (I couldn’t find anything on freshwater aquariums at short notice). According to the articles the effective life of AC ranges from 6 weeks to 6 months. I have ‘bolded’ a couple of pertinent points in the articles. http://www.ext.nodak.edu/extpubs/h2oqual/watsys/ae1029w.htm : Treatment Systems for Household Water Supplies Activated Carbon Filtration AE-1029, February 1992 Bruce Seelig, Water Quality Specialist, North Dakota Extension Service Fred Bergsrud, Water Quality Coordinator, Minnesota Extension Service Russell Derickson, Extension Associate in Water and Natural Resources, South Dakota Extension Service Eventually the AC filter loses its ability to remove contaminants, because it becomes clogged with material. In the case of taste and odour, the time to change the filter is easy to detect. However, in the case of other contaminants, it is more difficult to determine when the filter is no longer performing at an adequate level. Most manufacturers recommend a filter change after a certain volume of water has passed through the filter. Some AC units actually meter the water and automatically shut down after a specific quantity of water has passed through the filter. A general rule of thumb for high-volume AC filters is to change the filter after six months of use or 1000 gallons of filtered water. Tests done by Rodale Press Product Testing Department indicated that filtering performance was reduced dramatically after 75 percent of the manufacturer's recommended life time. These results suggest that filters should be changed more often than suggested by the manufacturer. Some AC filters are claimed to last for five years, because they are rechargeable with hot water (145 degrees F). The heat is supposed to release adsorbed organic chemicals. Little information is available on the prolonged effectiveness of rechargeable AC units. General recommendations are somewhat useful guidelines, but there is no guarantee that they apply to any specific situation. Remember, the only certain way of knowing whether contaminant levels are acceptable or not is by having your water tested. A sediment filter installed ahead of any AC filter will prolong the life of the AC unit. Sediment can easily clog the pores of an AC filter within a short period of time. A good sediment filter can be purchased for only a fraction of the price of most high volume AC filters. http://www.hallman.org/filter/gac.html : An Overview of Activated Carbon in the Marine Tank By James R. Layton Introduction The use of activated carbon in Marine aquariums has always sparked debate. In the past opinions ranged from “never use it” to “never be without it.” Today most aquarists consider activated carbon a beneficial and necessary component of their filtration system. Although many marine aquarists use activated carbon few know what is being removed or how carbon is beneficial to the marine aquarium. Then the manufacturing processes will be described and its effects on the finished carbon product. The filtration or sorption mechanism will be discussed in addition to factors affecting activated carbon performance. Lastly techniques for the use of carbon products is provided as well as a “consumer checklist” for evaluation and selection of activated carbon products for use in marine aquaria. Ideally aquarium water should be pre-filtered before contact with activated carbon. Pre-filters reduce the amount of particulate matter captured in between the carbon particles. Canister filters often provide an activated carbon chamber with pre-filtration capabilities. Special carbon contractors maximize contact time and allow for floss fibre as a pre-filter. Contrary to some authors, bags of activated carbon placed in the water flow work quite well. Laboratory studies have shown that bags of carbon or resins can remove substantial quantities of organic pollutants, medications, water hardness, and heavy metals. Actual performance depends on the flowability of the bag material, sorbent particle size, and amount of sorbent in the bag. Aquarists often ask how much activated carbon should be used in the aquarium. Some carbon products give recommendations while others give no indication at all. Independent research has shown that “more is better” when using activated carbon. When filtering municipal water or aquarium water a greater quantity of carbon will work faster and longer than a lesser amount. A rough guide would be two U.S. cups (480 c.c.) per 55 gallons (280 L.) of aquarium water. Some aquarists use more or less depending on their filtration system and quality of the carbon product they use. Most carbon products last about six weeks in a marine “fish” aquarium. Reef aquaria produce more organics than a regular aquarium and may require more frequent replacement. Activated carbon cannot be reactivated by boiling in water or heating in an oven, the temperature is too low to destroy the sorbed pollutants and restore sorptive capacity. Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MollyMan Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 As the article states, there are 2 schools of thought regarding carbon... those that dont, and those that do. The difference between Marine and Freshwater is huge, as the salinity of the Marine water environment helps prolong the carbons effect. To note, and I cant find the article in question, loose carbon placed in a standard HOB filter in a FW tank (0ppm salinity) lasted 96hrs... Also the carbon used for water filtration is highly refined, processed, and when you look at the volume it is in contact with (say a few litres a day) that will also explain its lifespan, compared to a filter that turns over 500g (2,000L) an hour, every hour... so as per the above article, if carbon lasts for 1000g, heck it only lasts 2 hours in my tank... I could copy and paste enough articles to have every body reading for a week, giving both sides of the argument, as mostly it is one of preference. The suggestion originally made was one to possibily save you some $$$ and effort, as most long time hobbyists will agree, well the few hundred I know anyway, that Carbon should only be used as it is intended, not 24/7. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Miller Posted January 16, 2004 Share Posted January 16, 2004 Hi MollyMan, I’m sure we could each find and post an equal number of articles in support of our opposing views on this subject. However, I think we are just going to have to agree to disagree. As I said before, I use carbon in all my tanks all the time. It works for me. I am more than happy with the condition of my tanks and fish (the fish must be happy too judging by all the breeding going on ). I strongly believe; ‘If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it!’ and I won't be changing a very successful formula to save the few dollars that the carbon costs me. But thanks for your 'heads-up' anyway. Cheers, Lee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazaf Posted January 16, 2004 Author Share Posted January 16, 2004 Thanks guys, i've done my stuff. i think i should leave the last few posts to you guys, thats ALOT of information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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