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Macro vs Zoom


MoliroMan

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Hi Guys.

The first 3 shots were done with a Canon EF 100mm macro F2.8 lens:

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The last 3 were taken with a Canon EF-S 17-85mm:

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I can't really tell any difference between them, in fact i believe the normal zoom lens takes better pics. The macro lens has a very narrow focal length so it is very difficult to take sharply focused shots since the fish just don't stay still!

I am pretty new to macro photography. Any tips to help me improve the shots are welcomed!

thx

Dave

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Yep I never thought macro was the best option for fish photo's when playing round with old film SLR's (this is years ago and I'm talking about shots of neon tetra schools and the like, and a very young me, using dad's camera's without permission woot.gif )

I do like macro now for taking pics of individual fish - although I don't have as much time as I'd like to tinker. Zoom lens shots also have been working for me lately. Should get some pics up soon... Maybe (did I mention I am lazy?)

I think it is one of those things that is very individual. It may well depend on the specific body and lens your using. As I think of late, I get crisper shots with the macro lens on my camera blink.gif But I had a play with dads camera in his tank and the long lens definately had something over his macro.

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It looks like you are getting good results with both, so my advice is to go with which option is easier for you, with less mucking around setting up for the shot.

I know how hard it is to get good shots of tropheus, so I'm very impressed with ALL of those shots wink2.gifclap.gif

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Thanks guys for all the kind words! I was just regretting that i bought that macro lens in the first place since it is very hard to set up the shot because u have a very limited focusing range so any movement will result in a blur. I will just have to practise the shots a lot more.

It is a 8 MP digital camera and turning out to be a very expensive hobby, just like keeping tropheus!!!

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What cam are you using with the macro lense MM?

I think the depth of field is bad with your macro lense because you have such a low F stop (2.8). What flash are you using? Are you using the on board camera flash?

Are you using auto focus or manual focus?

Trophs are very tricky subjects because they swim so eratically.

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Hi WW,

i am using the Canon digital SLR 350D.

Yes the f stop is 2.8 so has a very limited focal length which makes it hard to get a focused shot of erratic moving tropheus!

I use manual focus.

i am experimenting with slave flash photography with a flash above the tank, on the camera itself and at at angle to the tank next to the camera lens.

Dave

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Ok -

Dont give up on this macro lense, im sure you have the equipment to get a good photo. I wish i had a lense as nice as yours!

You have a few options.

1. No flash option

Try turning your ISO setting up to 800 without the flash and see if that helps. Make sure the room is dark, but that the tanks lights are on, and that you have as much light entering the tank from above as possible (add an extra light if you can). You need to be using a shutter speed of at least 1/150 to have any chance of getting a crisp image but i would try 1/200 in the first instance as the tropheus swim very quickly. Try shooting wide open (F stop 2.8) and also try bracketing by taking a few images at higher F stops say 3.4 up to ~5.6.

With your manual focussing, to ensure and decent image shooting at a low F stop you need to try to ensure the fish is parallell to your camera's lense. The only way to get a better depth of field is to increase your F stop, and to do that you will need to use a flash. In a number of the images you posted above only part of the fish is in focuss because it is running away diagonally from the camera.

For best results ensure that you focuss on the fish's eye.

2. Flash option

Because you are using your flash you need to change your settings. Try shooting with ISO of about 400, F stop of 12 (bracket from 8 up to 16 if you want) and this will also give you a better depth of field. Use a shutter speed about 1/200. If you are using the two flash method, with the slave flash from above the tank, you will want to try diffusing the on board flash with tissue paper and sticky tape, to make sure you dont wash out the image. Lighting macro subjects is very difficult.

Anyway - let me know how you go. There is a lot of trial and error involved, but because you have digital film its cheap to learn!

Good luck - may the photgraphic force be with you (im going to see star wars III tonight!)

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Thanks WW!

U must be an avid photographer to understand all the nuances of photography!

I have a few questions for u:

- why is it that the shutter speed is limited to 1/200 when i am using a flash?

- when i use a higher f stop i know i will get a better depth of field (DOF) but with the flash on, the shutter speed is too slow to get a unblurred shot of the fish, how can i overcome this?

- i did notice that i couldn't focus on the entire fish with the macro lens but only concentrated on the face/eyes of the fish. Thanks for the advice about parallel fish and lens. I was using a flash so was taking the fish at 45 degrees to the front of the tank to avoid flash reflection. I do have a speedlite 580EX so can twist the light at an angle. Do u have any advice on flashes? Should i get a macro ring light, they r so expensive?

I will try and use the force and develop my digital photography skills and post some more pics.

Thanks again for the detailed advice!

Did u enjoy Star Wars III?

Dave

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Lighting macro subjects is very difficult.

I can send this. Try 3 years of photographing fingerprints at 1:1 on a shiny silver curved surace! ARGH! I will second everything Steve (WW) said, and go one step futher to suggest a tripod unless you have a very steady hand.

Have you heard about the sniper breathing method? that's what i always use when shooting macro, cause it's very vulnerable to camera movement at the slower shutter speeds (obvious, but sometimes forgotten).

Looks like you're WELL on the right track.

What color is the back of your tank? It may be possible to bounce off that or your ceiling for an alternative to diffusing if you don't have the materials.

A tactic NSW police use is a stick that's set at the best length for fingerprint 1:1 photography - it's attached to the lens and yer, it's basically photography for non photographers. Possibly something to play with?

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Thanks WW!

1 why is it that the shutter speed is limited to 1/200 when i am using a flash?

- when i use a higher f stop i know i will get a better depth of field (DOF) but with the flash on, the shutter speed is too slow to get a unblurred shot of the fish, how can i overcome this?

2. Do u have any advice on flashes? Should i get a macro ring light, they r so expensive?

3. Did u enjoy Star Wars III?

no problems Dave - im not an expert but im getting into it more and more these days. I just need some more subjects

1. You can go faster than 1/200. That was just a guide. If your shots are overexposed at that setting then you should increase the shutter speed.

2. You dont need a ring light. Although if you do buy one can i borrow it! LOL.gif Nah a ring flash wont be great for fish photography. I dont actually know anyone who uses one. If you want to do flowers, bugs, etc then go for it if you have the funds, but the dual flash system is the go for fish photos. Try the diffused method and let me know how you go (post your results or email them to me)

3. Hell yeah. Loved it but i am a fan. First 20 minutes were increadible.

Good luck

One other thought, you might like to try honing your skills using slower fish.

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