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Fresh water Stingray

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Ive been looking at stingrays on the net and thinking of keeping one in my unused tank. Has anyone out there kept a freshwater stingray before? If so what sort of ray was it and how easy are they to keep? I was looking on the net and prices range from $150 to $15000....

Also how big do they grow, I have a 200L and 400L tank spare, would they be big enough?

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They are not a cichlid so you maybe asking in the wrong forum

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Ive been looking at stingrays on the net and thinking of keeping one in my unused tank. Has anyone out there kept a freshwater stingray before? If so what sort of ray was it and how easy are they to keep? I was looking on the net and prices range from $150 to $15000....

Also how big do they grow, I have a 200L and 400L tank spare, would they be big enough?

While they are pups, they can be housed in a 4ft with no problems but you would need to start thinking about a larger option within a few months of getting them, so you might as well start with the larger tank.

Keep in mind, their as much or more work than Cichlids, you will need really good filtration and regular water changes,they will get big, very fast, if they are motoro's 90-100cm when fully grown and eat heaps... producing a lot of waste, more than some large catfish.

You could keep them in a 6x2x2 for a while and do weekly 50% water-changes, a 8x3x2 would be much better, a 1000L tank would be recommended.

I sold a 6x3x1.5 a few weeks ago something that size would be ideal, if you can go 2.5 or 3 ft wide its better in the long run.

Remember its not just the price of the rays, as always the $ on tank size and filtration is more important...

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Ive been looking at stingrays on the net and thinking of keeping one in my unused tank. Has anyone out there kept a freshwater stingray before? If so what sort of ray was it and how easy are they to keep? I was looking on the net and prices range from $150 to $15000....

Also how big do they grow, I have a 200L and 400L tank spare, would they be big enough?

While they are pups, they can be housed in a 4ft with no problems but you would need to start thinking about a larger option within a few months of getting them, so you might as well start with the larger tank.

Keep in mind, their as much or more work than Cichlids, you will need really good filtration and regular water changes,they will get big, very fast, if they are motoro's 90-100cm when fully grown and eat heaps... producing a lot of waste, more than some large catfish.

You could keep them in a 6x2x2 for a while and do weekly 50% water-changes, a 8x3x2 would be much better, a 1000L tank would be recommended.

I sold a 6x3x1.5 a few weeks ago something that size would be ideal, if you can go 2.5 or 3 ft wide its better in the long run.

Remember its not just the price of the rays, as always the $ on tank size and filtration is more important...

Terrific answer, I enjoyed reading it :thumb

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Hi All,

So are Motoro's the smallest freshwater ray available on the Australian market ?

I'm thinking of getting an 8 x 2 x 2 display setup in around a years time and was wondering if i could have a freshwater ray and pending its water chemistry, feeding and maintainence requirements, what else i could have with it in the same tank.

Regards,

JayT

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$150 for a freshwater (Amazonian?) stingray? where? that is ridiculously cheap.

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If you go to rayfanatics.com it will answer all your questions and more.I've got a young pair of motoro's (absolutely stunning) and have them with a colony of satanoperca leucosticta and a small silver arowana in a 7x2x2 and am already planning for a larger tank.Luckily I have the room but would like one that I could put in the centre of the fishroom to view all round ,maybe 8x3x2.

Cheers Glen

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Aren't non-native freshwater rays all about to be declared noxious?

Not sure about species names, and not my area of expertise but that's what I have heard on the grape vine.

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we have native freshwater rays here in Aus ?

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You might want to have a read of this and consider signing. It relevant to the law changes your referring to and is on the Perth Cichlid Society website.

http://www.gopetition.com/petition/39081.html

Its a few months old but may still be active (i'm lead to believe this site removes petitions once no longer valid). It only takes about two minutes to complete anyway so cant hurt to do so.

Regards

JayT

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we have native freshwater rays here in Aus ?

I don't know. But I have caught a massive spotted ray in a tidal river up north. Don't know if it can live in fresh.

Edited by mattrox

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we have native freshwater rays here in Aus ?

yes... LFS in Melbourne had a largish one some time ago, about 18" in diameter. Caught by supplier in pure freshwater, silver in colour and quite active.

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Motoro Rays seem to be the most commonly available here that is going around but since we are on the topic of freshwater Rays does anyone also know that by adding some salt to your tank it wont harm the freshwater rays? As i was told that Freshwater rays do not like any salt?

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Australian Freshwater rays grow quite large and the collector generally wont supply unless you can prove that you have a 10,000litre heated pond to put it in, same goes with sawfish although the saws are extremely rare these days...

As for the motoro rays not allowed to be imported legally, may finish up on the noxious list because of that, time will tell..

All depends on whhich state you live in but SA for example they are imposibble to keep alive unless you use RO water, they dont handle high GH and nitrate from what ive been told by supplyers.....

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If you go to rayfanatics.com it will answer all your questions and more.I've got a young pair of motoro's (absolutely stunning) and have them with a colony of satanoperca leucosticta and a small silver arowana in a 7x2x2 and am already planning for a larger tank.Luckily I have the room but would like one that I could put in the centre of the fishroom to view all round ,maybe 8x3x2.

Cheers Glen

Cheers Glen - had a look at the site and it's really informative, cheers.

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As for the motoro rays not allowed to be imported legally, may finish up on the noxious list because of that, time will tell..

That wont be the sole reason to put in on the noxious list. Based on that theory, Bristlenose catfish will become noxious too!

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Quite sure that Motoro was allowable import for 6 months back in the 80's.

You guys may not be aware of the rediculous neck squeeze on the ornamental fish scene here in Perth by fisheries.

To sell to local shops, name, number and address needs to be given.

When fisheries does a check they can ask shop for details and the breeder gets a visit and fisheries take what they like if the species aren't on the import list.

Majority of species have come in a long time before regulations were made and may not be on the allowable list.

Fisheries have at least acknowledged this and stated species been here for a already extended time are fine.

The sentence above in turn creates hundreds n thousands of grey areas of controversy.

Anything goes when fisheries can play hardball in the durastictions of disease and pests.

If declared tainted by disease then that becomes non-allowable to.

Australian government doesn't care about ornamental fish industry.

A few other countries are almost religious with ornamental fish which sometimes makes me want to pack my bags,,,, lol.

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You guys may not be aware of the rediculous neck squeeze on the ornamental fish scene here in Perth by fisheries.

Not only fisheries but the importation of ornamental fish also. They are making it a lot harder and this will see a lot of the rarer species dissappear from the import list.

It is going to have a huge impact accross the hobby/industry nation wide..

Edited by Alvon

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It will be a big impact.

But the actual riftlake Cichlid market is now very small in Australia,,,, and demand is very low compared to history market.

I personally don't think it will impact as much as some may be thinking,,, considering not many rifties wanted are imported anyway.

95% roughly of sales are all in house (oz local) anyway.

The major problem is purity and actual species renewal yes, but this will happen very slowly,,, the reason why fish are lost here is because the market is so small compared to the enormity of specie diversity.

I'm beleiving/entrusting there are enough big library breeders in oz to safen the species stronghold they already have.

And for consumer/fish-hobbyists to respect fish prices and keep buying.

The new import laws are indeed very sad and have increased my hatred for fisheries separate to the job they do of keeping out diseases.

But in a way, it can make things a little more interesting.

It's not so much about what can't be bought in,,,, but it's more the cost of it,,,, so I can't see why shops across the states pitch in for a selected specie every three months,,, to pitch in for costs and bulk buy, within reason.

I'm sure within time overseas suppliers will obtain some sort of pre-certification for those that will do it and have Australia to themselves to supply.

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It will be a big impact.

But the actual riftlake Cichlid market is now very small in Australia,,,, and demand is very low compared to history market.

I personally don't think it will impact as much as some may be thinking,,, considering not many rifties wanted are imported anyway.

95% roughly of sales are all in house (oz local) anyway.

The major problem is purity and actual species renewal yes, but this will happen very slowly,,, the reason why fish are lost here is because the market is so small compared to the enormity of specie diversity.

I'm beleiving/entrusting there are enough big library breeders in oz to safen the species stronghold they already have.

And for consumer/fish-hobbyists to respect fish prices and keep buying.

The new import laws are indeed very sad and have increased my hatred for fisheries separate to the job they do of keeping out diseases.

But in a way, it can make things a little more interesting.

It's not so much about what can't be bought in,,,, but it's more the cost of it,,,, so I can't see why shops across the states pitch in for a selected specie every three months,,, to pitch in for costs and bulk buy, within reason.

I'm sure within time overseas suppliers will obtain some sort of pre-certification for those that will do it and have Australia to themselves to supply.

Im guessing you havent heard about the new batch testing requirements that were proposed..

If they are enfirced, say goodbye to tropheus, frontosa and and fish of value..

To give you an idea, you need to provide a sample from each batch for testing purposes.. For a batch of 20 fish, you need to supply 19 for testing.. You pay the supplier for 20 but end up with 1 fish.. pointless...

The more you import, the less percentage you need to supply but its minimum 19 fish, per batch, not per shipment.. Tha means if you importer 20 tropheus ikola and 20 tropheus duboisi, you will need to surrender 19 of each..

I think for 45 fish you need to submit 25-30 for testing..

So Frontosa that may cost an importer $150/fish, if 45 are ordered and testing is taken into account, the same fish has cost them $337.50.. Thats a wholesale price.. Thats doesnt include the disease testing which is probably $200+ per batch..

For guppys, neons and other bulk cheap fish, the tesing numbers wont affect the landed cost too much. Im pretty sure it caps at 119 fish required for testing.

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Yep heard all about it.

It's proposed and just that.

I haven't seen any consolidated final documentation yet.

The other subject of Perth's ruling, there are is a final worded documentation (still grey as hell), but that's done and we here know what's what on that.

I believe authorities on importation laws may just ramp it up to look worse than it is, then the final decision not as harsh.

Possibly a bit of a mind game to battle confrontation when final.

If a importer is asked at present what's happening,,, they themselves still aren't sure.

If fisheries haven't had time, money or infastructure to govern fish in the first place,,, how the hell are they going to control and organize these separated fish percentages for testing,,,,, judging the way they handle things now,,, it would take a year to finalize a 10x frontosa import.

I think the final decision will be what's easier for themselves which won't be collecting all those for tests.

Imagine first week of law change and everyone regardless of cost decided to import,,,, fisheries would be stuffed and well under man/resourced.

I'm using the term "fisheries" for any governing body, domestic or importation.

It's all still up in the air, and these are just the way I'm looking at it up to date.

No matter how it pans out,,,, we still have plenty good stuff here and in the hands of enough great "for life" breeders.

Most for life breeders don't reveal themselves much at all,,, not heard or seen, just their fish, lol.

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QUOTE(dhonti @ Mar 31st 2011 @ 10:46 )

If you go to rayfanatics.com it will answer all your questions and more.I've got a young pair of motoro's (absolutely stunning) and have them with a colony of satanoperca leucosticta and a small silver arowana in a 7x2x2 and am already planning for a larger tank.Luckily I have the room but would like one that I could put in the centre of the fishroom to view all round ,maybe 8x3x2.

Cheers Glen

Cheers Glen - had a look at the site and it's really informative, cheers.

Pics or you're making it up!! LoL.

Actually, any keepers here have some pics of theirs they wish to share? I'd love to see some!!

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Pups can be kept in smaller tanks, but I don't know for how long. I took a video of stingray pups in a shop here in Sydney. They were in a standard 5 ft tank or something.

But if you are going to keep a stingray for the long haul, a minimum of 6x2x2.5w is recommended. The wider the better, height is not as important.

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A lot of people see set ups like this with rays, and their imagination runs wild.

This set up above is EXTREMELY temporary and short lived.

The consensus of a minimum size tank of 6long x 2.5wide is a falicy, even a 3wide tank,,,, unless you have one male that is genetically very small.

Females get nearly twice the size of males.

Then the tail added on to make length double.

Stingrays in the hobby are usually treated poorly in a cruel fashion due to their requirements and actual true mature size.

The term "teacup" is a greedy sales plaw to hook the buyers in just hearing what they want to hear.

Ive bred truckloads of these and grown up over 50 to mature size for myself, and some of the larger specimens are over 10kg !!!!!

If anyone saw my rays and looked at a 6 x 2.5,,, they would no way consider them in that tank size.

Sorry I came on strong,,, but it's important that people know this when interested in these "the pinnacle of fish keeping" beasts.

They get big real quick.

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A lot of people see set ups like this with rays, and their imagination runs wild.

This set up above is EXTREMELY temporary and short lived.

The consensus of a minimum size tank of 6long x 2.5wide is a falicy, even a 3wide tank,,,, unless you have one male that is genetically very small.

Females get nearly twice the size of males.

Then the tail added on to make length double.

Stingrays in the hobby are usually treated poorly in a cruel fashion due to their requirements and actual true mature size.

The term "teacup" is a greedy sales plaw to hook the buyers in just hearing what they want to hear.

Ive bred truckloads of these and grown up over 50 to mature size for myself, and some of the larger specimens are over 10kg !!!!!

If anyone saw my rays and looked at a 6 x 2.5,,, they would no way consider them in that tank size.

Sorry I came on strong,,, but it's important that people know this when interested in these "the pinnacle of fish keeping" beasts.

They get big real quick.

I was going to say without the Stingrays in there that is one of THE most beautiful planted tanks I've seen outside of a zoo!!!

Ok, seeing as you've bred them to huge sizes and so many of them I would love to see some of your photo's you have of your old rays please????

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