Chafule Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 hey guys im new here.. im only 15 old kid and im starting my first tank its a 2 f tank i was wondering if i put in my DIY CO2 maker in for my plants to grow will i need to put in a normal air pump for the fish to survive or will the plants produce enough oxygen for the fish? Also is it good to put guppies, angel fish and sword tails together? if so wot ph should the water be and wot temp i havnt found that info yet Thx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wazza Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 Hi, welcome to the board. Im only 14 myself so yeah. Ok i have found over a couple of years experience that it is not neccessary to put an air pump in the tank. But i do it anyway and would suggest that you do also. Go for the C02 if you plan for a planted tank but if not i personally wouldnt bother. By the way, the DIY C02 works a treat and its basically free! Yep those fish should be absolutely fine together. But the angels do get big! but its nothing to worry about. The Ph should be 6.8-7.0. and the Temperature 26-28. HTH wazza Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHL Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 i was wondering if i put in my DIY CO2 maker in for my plants to grow will i need to put in a normal air pump for the fish to survive or will the plants produce enough oxygen for the fish? You need to ask yourself if the fish will survive as is without CO2 and no air pump; if they will, then they also will with CO2. FWIW, I don't have any airpumps in any of my tanks, but do have filters that disturb the water surface to some degree, and the one in my goldfish tank has a venturi to draw air in for the goldfish's entertainment (although they seem to have tired of it, so may remove it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CThompson Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 If you put an airpump in your tank, ALL CO2 produced by your “DIY CO2” will be blown off the tank. That is, not usable by the plants and wasted. Aeration would be required if there is not enough oxygen, plants are the most efficient form or aeration there is, even better than the best man can produce. BUT there are a lot of other variable that come into play that will determine wether or not the plants can perform at their best. One of these variables is pH, which needs to be below 7, 6.8-6.9 would be a target. This pH is not what fish such as guppies and swordtails like, so I would not recommend them for this tank regardless of the other occupants of the tank. A pair of angle fish (read male and female) would be good by them selves in this size tank and pH. If that is not enough movement for you, then skip the angle fish, and go for some tetras (colour to choice!). I imagine you already have the fish mentioned, but that will not change my advice, it will be up to you as to what you do. In a Planted tank the focus is on the plants and not the fish, if a Planted tank is the case you shouldn't have many fishn (compared to a fish, fishtank), and you won’t have to use a mechanical means to aerate the tank. One other thing, CO2 is usually used in a Planted tank, and not just a tank with plants in it. If you want to experiment with what you have that will be up to you, but, be aware CO2 and Planted tanks require a fair bit of information/knowledge to get the most out of. So, do more research, read more on the Internet (go to the Krib, they have a good section on Planted tanks), and read more books, and don’t forget to ask more questions. For example, start to do some reaseach on fertilisers, if the plants don't have access to what they need in this area, the CO2 may be not accessable to them anyway. Craig BTW I’m 41 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edward Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 I find that through 1st hand experience I tend to remember things better than reading about it I'm just a simpleton. I reckon give it a go and post your results. There is a planted tank section here too, you might wanna read that for ideas and such. Have fun. Ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wazza Posted January 23, 2004 Share Posted January 23, 2004 Are you planning a majorly planted tank or just a few plants, because if its just a couple of plants you dont really need C02. wazza Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHL Posted January 23, 2004 Share Posted January 23, 2004 Aeration would be required if there is not enough oxygen, plants are the most efficient form or aeration there is, even better than the best man can produce. BUT there are a lot of other variable that come into play that will determine wether or not the plants can perform at their best. I think you should differentiate between oxygenation and aeration; plants are great for oxygenation, but not aeration, unless the oxygen becomes super-saturated (unlikely without good light, CO2 and fertiliser). Just in case, I'd like to point out to those who may ask how can oxygen become supersaturated when you also have CO2, in water, the partial pressure of oxygen is independent of the partial pressure of CO2, so yes, you can have ppO2 of 1.02 (equivalent to 102% O2 in air) and still have CO2 and other dissolved gases in there. Deep enough, it can be even higher, as SCUBA divers would know. In a Planted tank the focus is on the plants and not the fish, if a Planted tank is the case you shouldn't have many fishn (compared to a fish, fishtank), and you won’t have to use a mechanical means to aerate the tank. The planted with few fish I believe is more the Dutch tank style, whereas the Natural Aquarium style (popularised by Amano) do use quite a lot of fish (at least Amano does in his tanks). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chafule Posted January 23, 2004 Author Share Posted January 23, 2004 alrite thx im planning to have lots of plants in my tank with only a few fishes so i would need the CO2 Btw thx Craig for the detailed info. being lectured from a old guy really sucks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHL Posted January 24, 2004 Share Posted January 24, 2004 im planning to have lots of plants in my tank with only a few fishes so i would need the CO2 You don't need CO2; there are successful planted tanks without CO2, but it will certainly help the plants grow better. BTW, how much light are you planning on having, and I assume you will have a fertilised substrate and a fertiliser programme as well? Just be aware that you also have to plan on doing a fair bit of prunning (speaking from experience)... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CThompson Posted January 26, 2004 Share Posted January 26, 2004 PHL Wether it is a Dutch style tank or an Amano, both have fewer amounts of fish than does a standard home aquarium, especially when one considers a tank run by a younger person. In both cases, the plants form the focus of the aquarium and not the fish. Wether Amano has more fish than Dutch, is neither here-nor-there, as the amount of plants in a fully established and functioning tank will oxygenate the tank. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHL Posted January 27, 2004 Share Posted January 27, 2004 Wether it is a Dutch style tank or an Amano, both have fewer amounts of fish than does a standard home aquarium, especially when one considers a tank run by a younger person. I didn't think about that; yes, most tanks do seem rather crowded with fish, and some people don't believe in having plants, or have plastic plants! I don't populate mine heavily, so haven't considered that point. And yes, they are planted aquariums, but I enjoy the fish for their character. My feeling from reading and viewing setups is that the Dutch, as you say, focus more on the plants, whereas Amano uses both plants, rocks, wood and fish complement each other, to create his aquascapes, which he calls a natural aquarium, to mimic an aspect of nature. He specifically distants himself from the Dutch aquariums. If you read his aquarium notes, he even tells you why he chose a particular fish (mainly characins) for his aquascape. And some of his aquascapes are very austere plant-wise, with his favoured Ricca and rocks, with the fish providing the colour. And yes, plants are an excellent oxygenators. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chafule Posted February 2, 2004 Author Share Posted February 2, 2004 yer im having that amano type tank i dont know how high volt my light will be ive decided to make a co2 thx for the help guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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