phillip Posted April 28, 2004 Share Posted April 28, 2004 hello all, i am in the process of converting my 4x2x2 cichlid tank into a plant tank, which i wish to keep a few discus, clowns, peppermint cats and filled with plants (but not gonna be too overcrowded with plants) i cannot afford metal halides so i decided to use 3 4ft light tubes they are: 1 aquastar 10000K, 1 growlux, and 1 hitachi specialist aquarium tube I have a ehiem cannister filter for the tank, and will have internal filter for the flow of water inside the tank. Next i am going to buy some gravel and dirt such as peat moss, vermuculite and aqualine terralit. The only thing puzzling me is the CO2 system, is this really needed for the plants? or can they grow and become healthy without one? I will spend about $150-200 but some lfs say that i'll need to spend more than $300-400!!!, What do you guys think? can u recommend any good co2 systems that are cost effecient and effective. If there is anything else that u think i should do with my tank or add plz tell me. Because i am always wanting to know opinions. thankyou in advance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mbuna Posted April 28, 2004 Share Posted April 28, 2004 why dont you try a did c02 system. there are plenty of diy plans on the net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHL Posted April 28, 2004 Share Posted April 28, 2004 You don't need CO2 if you don't mind growing the plants more slowly, and not growing some of the more picky ones (I find Echinodorus like CO2; very slow without). As for supply of CO2, you can go DIY, but personally I found pressurised CO2 much easier. I went with the Dupla setup, which was around $500, but there are cheaper setups, but still a lot more than with yeast (bought and DIY), but much easier to use, less fuss as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anubias Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 Here's my setup for CO2, been working for years and is cheap as chips: 1. This is the most imporant thing-find a decent bottle, I like the 2L juice bottles, from companies like Berri, you know the ones with the extra pouring handle. Either buy it yourself or have a look around on recycling night. Make sure it has the cap, and that the cap has that little insert for a tight seal. 2. Drill or bore a hole(with a knife) into to middle if the cap(take out the insert first) just smaller than the air hose you have. Fold the airhose in half in order to squash it through the slightly too small hole you now have in the cap, if it goes in too easily the hole is probably too big and you will have trouble later on. 3. Once the hose is in, seal around the hole(inside and outside the cap) with some silicone. This isn't always necessary, but it certainly makes a perfect seal. Wait a day for it to dry. 4. Cut a small window out of the cap insert to accomodate the silicone you've put there. 5. Put about a cup of sugar in the bottle and fill 4/5ths with water. Leave overnight. 6. Put a teaspoon of brewers/bakers yeast in the bottle, the stuff that comes in little induvidual packets is usually best as it keeps fresh. Put the lid on your bottle, it should now be dry, and stick the airhose in an appropriate place (in the tank!). Maybe you want to put it into a bell, or near the filter intake (though I personally worry about the impeller too much to do this), or just through an airstone. 7. Watch the plants grow an inch each day. And buy yourself something nice with the $500 you saved Cheers, Alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMill Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 Hi Phillip, I have found DIY CO2 to be a real pain in the butt for anything over 2'. You can get a regulator/needle valve combo for around $140, and can build a bubble counter/reactor. Problem you will have is that at 2' deep, fluoros are really not going to provide a lot of light anyway, in which case adding CO2 may be superfluous. Really depends on what you want to grow. Since you are planning on keeping discus, maybe just lots of java fern attached to wood, in which case I would do away with the CO2 and not worry about having a nutrient rich substrate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phillip Posted May 1, 2004 Author Share Posted May 1, 2004 ok i decided that the co2 system would be too expensive so i will be making about 2 diy co2 systems thankyou guys, i know that the 2 diy co2 is not enough for a 4x2 so i am getting some low maintenance plants that don't require that much of a co2 system, here is wat i am getting: blue stricta wisteria baby ozelots baby rubra baby radicas amazon swords java moss java fern wendelov crispus ambulia bateri infusoria and some others I talked to some other lfs owners and they said that you don't really need the peat moss and the vermuculite, neither the dupla g substrate laterite and they only recommended just having the gravel but to just have the seachem iron and non-iron solutions. Do you think that this is alright? or would i need the others? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett4Perth Posted May 2, 2004 Share Posted May 2, 2004 Hi Phillip, I run a 4ft tank with 3 flouros/DIYCO2 and the plants do quite well. The only difference is that my tank is not quite as deep as yours. Most of the plants you are considering grow well in my tank. You do not get the explosive growth of the high light tanks and there are plants that don't thrive in my system, but I still have to prune twice a month and that is enough for me I would disagree with the advice you were given about the substrate. Enriched substrates improve plant growth and the minimum I would consider is adding laterite. Personally I have had best result with soil/vermiculite mixes. I have never tried peat. The substate is the one thing you want to get right the first time, it is a pain to change later The problem with DIY CO2 systems is variable production. A bell method is a safe approach as excess CO2 bubbles harmlessly out of the tank. It is difficult to achieve the 20-30ppm recommended using this method, but you can add enough additional CO2 to improve growth noticably without running the risk of unstable pH swings. I use Anubias set-up with 2 bottles in series Good Luck Brett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phillip Posted May 5, 2004 Author Share Posted May 5, 2004 just wondering has anyone used peat moss with some laterite and verimiculite because i just added them to my tank and a lot of the stuff is floating, i am planning to syphon the rocks out and clean them and put it back into the tank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHL Posted May 5, 2004 Share Posted May 5, 2004 If you use peat and laterite, you layer it (mixed with gravel) about 2" on the bottom, then cover it with 1-2" of gravel on top. That way it doesn't float away, or mess up the tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phillip Posted May 5, 2004 Author Share Posted May 5, 2004 lol its already floating,well some of them anyway. now i have to syphon out all the gravel and start again. grrrrrrr this time i am never going to touch laterite, peat moss or virmiculite again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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