8ft tank cycling period?

[Downunder]

G'day guys/gals,

anyone have a rough idea on how long it takes for a tank 8x2x2, with a wet/dry setup (180L total volume) to cycle? I have 2 blue acara's in there(medium sized), a dozen or so shrimp, and I've cleaned one of my powerfilters from my other tank in the water to try and give it a head start. My pumps pumping 4800lph and the mediums are scoria and filter wool in large quantities. Also what type of ammonia & nitrite peak am I looking at for a rough guide. Any feedback would be great, cheers.

Wayne

[fishie4me]

hey bro

if you have any cotton, sponge that has been used in another tank, just squeeze some of it into the new tank, due to the old stuff has heaps of bacteria and therefore will make help the tank setup more quickly.

[ViS]

While that is true, the bacteria doesn't usually do too well once forced off it's "house" in the sponge. You are better off leaving the sponge dirty with bacteria and putting the entire filter on the new tank. Just borrow a filter from a mate, put it on an established tank for a week and then transfer it to the 8 footer. Let the 8 footer cycle for a couple of weeks at least, and add a few fish after a week or so, just to help kick it along.

[Callatya]

I know new stuff is generally frowned upon, and usually i'm the one doing the frowning... but the new version of Hagen's Cycle is pretty good for cycling things in a hurry.

I have used it on a number of occasions and found it to cycle most things within 48 hours... but you do haveto feed the bacteria in order for them to grow.

I usually lightly stock the tank, add the Cycle and go from there.

you can also use straight household ammonia to feed the bacteria, but its a lot more fiddly.

[Downunder]

Thanks for the replies.

Appreciated. Looks like I'll just sit it out. I need my filter for my current 4fter which is stocked full ready for the big tank. About the ammonia idea though, can you just buy pure ammonia and drop it in your tank? I have no idea as my wife does all the shopping and I try to distance myself from it as much as possible . Cheers

Wayne

[Peter_Gun_Riff]

ive read that using pure ammonia in FW tanks does more bad then good is that right

[tangfish]

hi wayne

take the dirty filter wool from your four ftr and put it in the 1st part of the sump.

also a handfull of substrate from the four ftr will help greatly.

please stay away from h/hold bleach or anything else not meant to be used in tanks the pain and suffering is just not worth the short cut.take it slowly with the changeover and all will be well.

regards tangfish.

[OziOscar]

I've used fishless cycling successfully in the past.

It's just a matter of working out how much to use (pure ammonia available commercially is usually a 10% solution) for the water volume, keeping it at 5 ppm until you get a nitrite spike and then backing off to 50% dose until you get say 20 ppm nitrate. When you hit the nitrate spike, stop the ammo dosing and your ammo reading will fall to 0 ppm within a couple of days, as will your nitrate... and you're off and ready to fully stock.

It takes about two weeks without seeding the tank with a 'live' cannister or other 'live' filtration devices. With live media, you can get lucky and have it happen within about five days.

Big hint: No livestock should be in the tank when you do it else you will corpse them up - guaranteed.

I've also used a combo of Cycle, Stress Coat and Stress Zyme as it was sworn by from a fella I knew. Worked nicely and makes the tank pretty OK within a few days (new cannister, dead media), but if the dosage is too high you can get a heterotrophic bacterial bloom that can hang around for a while (couple of weeks) and make the tank look cloudy. I only use this method in an emergency (ie new stock incoming and no space in the other tanks). It could be used to boost / stabilise a tank that is uncycled and needs to be loaded up in a hurry.

These are my experiences and I could be totally wrong... but it has seemingly worked well with zero mortality. DISCLAIMER: Your mileage may vary.

Lots of luck.

Cheers - OziOscar.

[Downunder]

Cheers once again. I reckon if I go with the ammonia idea I'll have to remove everything from the tank, and that is not going to happen . Looks like the old ways are the easiest, though maybe not the quickest. I'll grab a handfull of gravel out of my other tank though, and put one of my sponges into the trickle wool. I'm hoping it will start cycling quicker as it has been a week and still no nitrite present. My test kit is picking up ammonia levels at 1.2mg/l, but as I'm using PRIME and reading other posts about how PRIME affects the readings for ammonia, it's all up in the air at the moment. Both my fish are still alive though, but they have been through worse so it's not a real indication, and the shrimp are from the Murray! Oh well back to the cycling process .

Wayne

[Flashgordon]

In simple terms, bear in mind there can be two types of ammonia in the tank - good and bad. When you use a product that neutralises ammonia such as Prime or Ammolock etc, it effectively changes the ammonia from bad to good, but it is still present in the tank.

Most test kits can not differentiate between the two and report total ammonia present, not just the bad stuff. The only product I am aware of that reports on bad ammonia exclusively - in other words tells you when you have an ammonia probloem in your tank that might kill your fish - is the Seachem Ammonia Alert test card which sits in the tank all the time stuck to the glass and gives a constant reading of the presence or absence of bad ammonia in the tank. It is available from any or all of the forum sponsors.

[Downunder]

So basically I have 1.2mg/l of 'good' ammonia in my tank, and am waiting for the 'bad ammonia to peak and maybe overtake this figure? I'm using the Hagen test kit. Sounds like it is easier not to worry about the ammonia and just the nitrite levels when cycling. Cheers

Wayne

[Downunder]

I've tested my water again today and the nitrites are at 0.8 mg/l, with the ammonia at 2.4 mg/l(looks like the bad ammonia has overtaken the good). I'm guessing that the cycling is in full swing now, and it's only been a week. Hopefully my ammonia is at/close to it's peak, and now it's the nitrites turn. Fingers crossed. i've put the bacteria from another filter into the overflows to help speed it up even more also. The fish seem non-fussed and bored.

Wayne

[Callatya]

I've used the pure ammonia thing, the dead prawn thing and the traditional thing. All have their place, depending on what you want to achieve

Sounds like you are going really well there. I would just keep going with your current plan.

With the 'good' and 'bad' ammonia, thats a tad misleading. Its probably more accurate to call the good one 'safe'. As i recall, it binds the ammonia so that although the bacteria can still eat it, its harder to get at. The probablem with binding the ammonia, is that if you arent paying attention, you can get a stinking great big nitrite spike once the binding chemical is used up. Shouldnt happen in your tank with that many fish, just something for later.

The ammonia alert tabs can be useful, but i had 2 of them fail me big time this week, one in a tank with a rotting prawn, and one in a tank with 2 dead platies! both stayed on yellow. I was absolutely fuming. I have been quite ill and was somewhat relying on those to give me an indication of where my tanks were at. If it wasnt for the fact that i recognised the signs of ammonia poisoning, i could have lost a whole heap more.

And yeah, i followed the directions to the letter and handled these devices very carefully. Both were from different stores too. I'm very temptd to do a tolerance test on them and see just how much ammonia they need to change colour!

Its the nessler kits that will give you false readings. There is another sort of test that will give you a 'free ammonia' reading, but for the life of me i cant remember the name of it.

Anyway, just keep an eye on the behaviour of the fish. Try not to do a water change if you can help it (but if they need it, dont hesitate) as it will slow things right down.