Cloudy water

[Chris.K]

my water has gone from crystal clear to cloudy in a couple of days. this has happened once b4 and went away on its own in a few days but this time its cloudier than before and freakin frustrating.

amm/nitrite/nitrate = 0

ph = 8.2

temp = 25deg

i am paranoid about overfeeding so am very frugal in my food delivery so its not overfeeding. fish are not behaving any differently at this stage and seem to be fine.

tank is now i suppose 3 weeks old.

week 1: no fish

week 2: added 6 juv fish

week 3: added another 6 juv fish

what causes this cloudiness and how can i get rid of it ?

[Rod54]

You're right.

3 weeks old!!!

0 ammonia???

0 nitrite???

goggle "cycle an Aquarium"

The tank will be real cloudy shortly....full of dead fish!

[Chris.K]

i have googled it and there are about 10 different versions of how to cycle an aquarium..not to mention the LFS who also have their versions.

rather than be an obnoxious prat about it, why not offer something constructive ?

[cpfc]

Keep an eye on chemistry and check filters. My first move would be water 25% water change and wash wool filters in removed tank water.

[Rod54]

Perhaps the reason I'm being an "obnoxious prat"

and I suggested you goggle rather than giving you details

is because you are obviously lying......you haven't done any water tests....have you!!!

Call me what you like....I've given you all the information I'm prepared too

Ammonia in a newly set-up aquarium will continue to rise for 7~8 days before starting to decrease. Usually it is not until 11 or 12 days after set-up that the ammonia concentration drops below 0.1 mg/L. Nitrite concentration in the same newly set-up aquarium can reach concentrations of nearly 10 mg/L. Furthermore, the nitrite level may stay high for several weeks. Usually the nitrite concentration does not drop below 0.1 mg/L until 25 to 30 days after the aquarium is first set-up.

[Chris.K]

Perhaps the reason I'm being an "obnoxious prat"

and I suggested you goggle rather than giving you details

is because you are obviously lying......you haven't done any water tests....have you!!!

Call me what you like....I've given you all the information I'm prepared too

first of all why would i lie ? what possible good would that do for me ?

secondly, i tested it this morning, got the lfs to verify this arvo and tested it again about an hour ago.

here is a photo of the result:

like i said, obnoxious prat.

[Josh]

Have you got picture in front of today's newspaper so that Rod will believe the test are current?

[LithoMan]

bacterial bloom... time fix's it it has happened to me a few times even on established tanks.. no real fix apart from time and small water changes..

if its white cloudy color and if its yellow or green could be algae blossom ..

i am no expert but just talking out of experience i have had.

once mine went for 2 weeks before it fixed itself.i posted picture on different forum and a lot of people helped and explained mine was a bristlenose breeding tank. feed half the amount you normally feed not to promote more growth and less light.

[Chris.K]

lfs checked my water again this morning; everything checked out. i do also have a large build up of frothy bubbles on the surface of the water. they are unsure exactly what the issue given all the water parameters are ok but given the frothy bubbles they reckon its more than likely bacterial bloom as LithoMan suggested. in light of that they recommended this:

replace the filter wool from inside the filter: did that, filter wool was a light brown in colour.

do a 25% water change: did that.

does up with some easylife: did that.

so i've done all i can do for now. just a waiting game.

hopefully the fish havent become to stressed with all the stuff i;ve added and water changes and all the rest of that crap. they seem to be swimming around pretty actively at the moment and i know they're hungry cos they follow me around the room every time i get up so i have my fingers crossed.

[CThompson]

A new tank MUST go through a cycling process. How long it takes will depend a bit on when it starts, but once it does start, can take 4-6 weeks to fully cycle.

There are commercially available products that can reduce the cycle period and even completely eliminate it.

A cloudy tank is just a bacterial bloom. Don’t worry about it will not hurt the fish, and will clear on its own. Sometimes a fully established tank can have the same issue, but is much more usual in a new tank.

Keep a close eye on the ammonia and nitrite levels, ammonia will spike fist then nitrite. One they flat-line you will have nitrate, and ammonia and nitrite will stay at zero.

If either get too high, do water change to reduce.

Send me a PM if you want more info.

Most aquarium related questions will have as many different answers as the number of people you ask. But the above is probably the best/most accurate/most popular answer you’ll get.

[robfishfan]

age before beauty , goes for many things !

[Aquaholic]

I'm not sure what your test kit is as mine shows clear if ammonia and nitrite are nil. If you have nil ammonia and nil nitrite you should have nitrate readings, which would mean your tank is cycled. Which is odd that is why rod doubted your results. Continual water changing would lengthen the cycling process. If you only added fish week 2 how did you cycle the tank in one week.( week three). Did you use a cycled filter? media etc.

If your picture was with my test kits , you have ammonia,nitrite and nitrate readings. test tube 2 looks like Ph.

If you do have nil readings it means your tank has not started cycling yet.

[Chris.K]

A new tank MUST go through a cycling process. How long it takes will depend a bit on when it starts, but once it does start, can take 4-6 weeks to fully cycle.

There are commercially available products that can reduce the cycle period and even completely eliminate it.

A cloudy tank is just a bacterial bloom. Don’t worry about it will not hurt the fish, and will clear on its own. Sometimes a fully established tank can have the same issue, but is much more usual in a new tank.

Keep a close eye on the ammonia and nitrite levels, ammonia will spike fist then nitrite. One they flat-line you will have nitrate, and ammonia and nitrite will stay at zero.

If either get too high, do water change to reduce.

Send me a PM if you want more info.

Most aquarium related questions will have as many different answers as the number of people you ask. But the above is probably the best/most accurate/most popular answer you’ll get.

thanks. i may do that if things dont clear up. cloudiness is slowly reducing. all the levels of everything i can test for look ok. fish are active so it cant be anything too bad. more annoying at this stage.

I'm not sure what your test kit is as mine shows clear if ammonia and nitrite are nil. If you have nil ammonia and nil nitrite you should have nitrate readings, which would mean your tank is cycled.

its an API kit. tests are all fine, this isnt rocket science. you put a few drops in a glass tube. lol

Which is odd that is why rod doubted your results.

no, he doubted my post cos he's an obnoxious prat. i didnt come to this forum and ask for help to be abused. if he thinks its a stupid question then he should have just dodged the topic.

Continual water changing would lengthen the cycling process. If you only added fish week 2 how did you cycle the tank in one week.( week three). Did you use a cycled filter? media etc.

If your picture was with my test kits , you have ammonia,nitrite and nitrate readings. test tube 2 looks like Ph.

If you do have nil readings it means your tank has not started cycling yet.

thanks for the tip. unfortuantely everyone seems to have different versions. some say do regular 10-20% water changes once a week. others say dont do any until everything has cycled. some say add bacteria, others say not to. the list goes on and on and the advice is all very contradicatory.

i'm just hoping its bacterial bloom and that means the cycle may be commencing. all i can do is keep an eye on the levels and see what happens.

[Aquaholic]

You would only do water changes if parameters get high enough to be harmful to your fish so it depends on the readings. Use prime when changing water as it detoxifies ammonia and nitrite. When you start getting nitrite readings your tank has started cycling. Note the higher ph the more harmful ammonia is so a lower ph may be better. Adding bacteria to your filter can speed up the cycling process.

I never need to cycle a new tank as I run multiple cannister's on my tanks. To set up a new tank I use 50% existing tank water and 50% new water. Move a cannister and sponge to the new tank and put a new cannister and sponge in the old tank. Never have a problem.

[cpfc]

The advice is contradictory and often the context is missing. I am pretty sure that if the spikes that CThompson mention happen your trusty LFS would give the same advice as he is. What I do is give the facts to the LFS guy as you do and see what they say. I mention advice given here and listen to why that would be done etc. Bloody confusing at times.

I predict on my experience you will get brown algae next as part of the cycle.

My question is what is too high nitrite? Like a lot of things I have read conflicting advice. The online lab at www.sera.de can be fun but do not take too seriously.

thanks for the tip. unfortuantely everyone seems to have different versions. some say do regular 10-20% water changes once a week. others say dont do any until everything has cycled. some say add bacteria, others say not to. the list goes on and on and the advice is all very contradicatory.

i'm just hoping its bacterial bloom and that means the cycle may be commencing. all i can do is keep an eye on the levels and see what happens.

[Chris.K]

You would only do water changes if parameters get high enough to be harmful to your fish so it depends on the readings.

i was under the impression that you should do a 10-20% water change as part of your regular routine maintenance regarldess of what the readings are ??

btw: whats the difference between prime ager and easy-life, (http://www.majesticaquariums.com.au/ProductDes.aspx?p=23) ?

i only put prime into the tank when i change water.

[cpfc]

I believe Aquaholic means that on top of your routine. I use Seachem Prime to condition water ie remove chlorine and chloramine. It can be used in higher quantities to remove nitrites and ammonia in an emergency. Anyone using tap water in an aquarium uses a conditioner such as prime to remove chlorine. I add it to premixed water prior to adding to an aquarium.

Easylife seems to claim a cure for cancer however I would like to see real world reports from aquarists. It claims to remove chlorine over hours so does not seem to be a water conditioner like Prime.

You would only do water changes if parameters get high enough to be harmful to your fish so it depends on the readings.

i was under the impression that you should do a 10-20% water change as part of your regular routine maintenance regarldess of what the readings are ??

btw: whats the difference between prime ager and easy-life, (http://www.majesticaquariums.com.au/ProductDes.aspx?p=23) ?

i only put prime into the tank when i change water.

[robfishfan]

i ran out of prime last November, and everything is still fine no deaths , i live in the city , but be careful , this does not work for everyone , depends where you live and how long you have had your fish , but that's another can of worms .

[Rod54]

For anyone prepared to listen.....

It is very important to establish a strong bacterial colony in a tank to process ammonia and nitrite....desirably before you add fish you value

As Craig says it takes 4 to six weeks to cycle a tank....

Following is the best info I've found re cycling a tank and it explains what happens and why

the graph explains what happens very well

New tank syndrome

If you have a 0 reading for ammonia then the cycle process hasn't started(but this is hard to understand if the tank has a dozen fish in it for 2 weeks???).....or your test kit is wrong or you have added products to the water or filter to remove ammonia.....???

When you are cycling a tank a reading for Ammonia(for the first 2 weeks) is a GOOD thing.....the bacteria needed to process ammonia can't start without food(Ammonia) and the bacteria needed to process nitrite can't develop if ammonia hasn't be converted to nitrite

Water changes and use of prime etc may be used to reduce stress on fish....but it will increase the time it takes to cycle a tank

Personally....particularly in an Alkaline tank (I agree with aquaholic) I wouldn't cycle a tank with fish I want to keep......if they don't die they will be stressed and may be prone to all sorts of diseases....

I'd stock a tank with feeder fish(gudgeons) till the cycle was complete....ie Ammonia=0,nitrite=0,nitrate>0

Lots of new players don't understand the cycle process and assume a zero reading for all toxins is a GOOD thing.....and it is....BUT ONLY...once the tank is cycled and that will take at least 6 weeks from the introduction of fish....particularly if you are doing water changes

BEST OF LUCK!!!

[Chris.K]

thank you.

[Aquaholic]

i ran out of prime last November, and everything is still fine no deaths , i live in the city , but be careful , this does not work for everyone , depends where you live and how long you have had your fish , but that's another can of worms .

You can age water for 24 hours plus which will help but I wouldnt risk it myself. You might be lucky and getting some of that RO water from the desal plant. lol

[cpfc]

Anyone in south Sydney notice a change in water since the desal plant?

i ran out of prime last November, and everything is still fine no deaths , i live in the city , but be careful , this does not work for everyone , depends where you live and how long you have had your fish , but that's another can of worms .

You can age water for 24 hours plus which will help but I wouldnt risk it myself. You might be lucky and getting some of that RO water from the desal plant. lol

[CThompson]

My question is what is too high nitrite? Like a lot of things I have read conflicting advice.

In an established tank any nitrite is too high as, as it should be zero, it indicates there is a problem.

In a cycling tank nitrite that is too high is a nitrite level that kills fish.

I think it is as simple as that. KISS

[Chris.K]

so a week on and the cloudiness is still there. not better or worse. frothy bubbles are still on water surface which lfs says is wastes that cant be processed cos good bacteria not established. tests are all still reading 0 for everything. PH is spot on and stable. so to Rod's point, i take it that the cycling process hasnt even started yet ?

lights are only on for a couple of hrs per day. nothing is being added to the water at all. i ceased doing water changes this week because i figure if i change water and add prime to it, this will also remove ammonia and if i keep doing that and don't get ammonia then i dont even get the cycle going...is this correct logic ?

fish are still all fine and active. have cut down the feeding a bit and lfs gave me a snippet of their filter wool which i put into my filter which i hope, (cant hurt to try !), will kickstart some of the good bacteria. its baffling me why there is no ammonia there are everything i've read suggests that when you have fish, the fish waste produces ammonia which is what i need for the bacteria to feed off ? right ? lfs says perhaps its cos the fish are small, feeding is light, tank is relatively big...they arent crapping enuf basically to get it going. buggered if i know.

a different lfs suggested getting some bottled "good bacteria". i have held off doing this cos i want to try and get it done "naturally". am i being impatient of is this just plain wierd ? is it even possible for me to not get any readings of anything and the tank having actually gone thru a cycle ?

my next question is, when i eventually do get any ammonia reading, do i add anything to neutralise it or is this again defeating the whole purpose and i have to let at least some ammonia in to get things going.

frustrating as hell i gotta say.

cpfs: funny you should mention sydney water quality. saw a story on fox today that said that extra chlorine has been added to sydney water as a result of the heavy rains increasing sediment and pollution levels of water reservoirs. so for those well estanblished tanks this could mean that an increase of prime dechlorinator dosage to water during changes may be required.

[ant265]

my next question is, when i eventually do get any ammonia reading, do i add anything to neutralise it or is this again defeating the whole purpose and i have to let at least some ammonia in to get things going.

As stated above that defeats the purpose as the bacteria in filter need to feed off it and multiply enough to cope with stocking level of fish then process ammonia into nitrite which is their waste then different bacteria will colonise which feed off nitrite converting that into nitrate. Now tank has 'cycled' and you can do a water change to reduce nitrate