hardb0iled Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 I'm wondering if 2 x 250w heaters will be enough to heat and maintain an ~840L tank to around 20 celsius? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducksta Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 It depends on how much heating they will have to do. What is the ambient temp of the room the tank is in? Assuming it is subject to normal Melbourne weather I would think not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlakeyBoyR Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 There are far more effective ways of heating, but they depend on your filtration system really. If you were insistant upon the two heaters idea, I'd very strongly recommend 2x Jager 300w heaters, theyre strong, reliable, have a long warranty, and heat a much larger quantity of water per watt of power than most other heaters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duck Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 maybe 2x400w hydor heater? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gargamel Posted January 7, 2006 Share Posted January 7, 2006 i think the 300 w jager does up to 1000 litres. i know it does alot more than the usual watt per litre rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrontyKing Posted January 7, 2006 Share Posted January 7, 2006 My 300w Jager does my 6x2x2 without a problem to 26 degrees in the winter. So with the sump I guess it's a total of 720 odd litres. Not bad for one heater. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlakeyBoyR Posted January 7, 2006 Share Posted January 7, 2006 I have no doubts in regards to their quality, hence me recommending them so strongly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colfish Posted January 7, 2006 Share Posted January 7, 2006 how about a waterbed heat pad. external thermal control, good even heat distribution area, J.A.T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hardb0iled Posted January 8, 2006 Author Share Posted January 8, 2006 The tank at the moment with no heater at all is at about 22c, there will be a single Murray Cod in the tank so its not critical that the temp be stable at a certain number but I would like to keep it at about 20-22 degrees. The tank is in my bedroom so ambient temp shouldnt get all that low even in winter? The heaters will be in a sump filter so plenty of water movement over the heaters. I would normally go for 2 x 300W heaters but AOA has a special on 250W stainless heaters with the remote temp adjustment which I ideally wanted for my sump, so I can get 2 x 250W heaters for less than the price of 1 x 300W I was hoping they would do the job being that temp is not over critical in this set-up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaZ Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 how about a waterbed heat pad. external thermal control, good even heat distribution area, J.A.T. ← I use a waterbed heater under a sump. Works amazingly well, has never skipped a beat in around 7 years, and is under the sump out of sight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bit Racer Posted January 9, 2006 Share Posted January 9, 2006 I have no doubts in regards to their quality, hence me recommending them so strongly. ← It's great how Jagar/Eheim are doing the right thing by its customers and offering a replacement of the old failed blue tops with the new model. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wui39 Posted January 9, 2006 Share Posted January 9, 2006 I heard they are even replacing ones that haven't shown any faults. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducksta Posted January 9, 2006 Share Posted January 9, 2006 The tank at the moment with no heater at all is at about 22c, there will be a single Murray Cod in the tank so its not critical that the temp be stable at a certain number but I would like to keep it at about 20-22 degrees. The tank is in my bedroom so ambient temp shouldnt get all that low even in winter? The heaters will be in a sump filter so plenty of water movement over the heaters. I would normally go for 2 x 300W heaters but AOA has a special on 250W stainless heaters with the remote temp adjustment which I ideally wanted for my sump, so I can get 2 x 250W heaters for less than the price of 1 x 300W I was hoping they would do the job being that temp is not over critical in this set-up? ← In that case maybe 3x 250W would be the best option? The problem isn't so much for your fish if the temperature gets cold, but what happens to the undersized heaters is that they stick on right through the cold period unable to actually defy the ambient temperature to heat the tank sufficiently. This ends up costing bucketloads more in power as a heater with a better output would actually heat more rapidly, keep the temp stable, and spend alot less time 'on'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted January 9, 2006 Share Posted January 9, 2006 All these people that try to save a few bucks now and end up paying more in the long run ! 1 x Jaeger 300w heater for around $50-$60 will do the job for your 840L tank. Now, this might seem like more money than 2 x chinese made heaters, however you will make up the difference in approx 12 months and you will only be in front for years thereafter. I would estimate on your 840L tank in Melbourne that your annual heating bill for 2 x chinese heaters would be around $100. It is difficult to say exactly how much you might save with the Jaeger, however the Germans never make false claims with their products. I would estimate you would save somewhere between $25 and $50 annually with the Jager 300w. Thiese savings are per annum ! Everyone with any size tank can make serious savings with Jager heaters ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hardb0iled Posted January 9, 2006 Author Share Posted January 9, 2006 All these people that try to save a few bucks now and end up paying more in the long run ! 1 x Jaeger 300w heater for around $50-$60 will do the job for your 840L tank. Now, this might seem like more money than 2 x chinese made heaters, however you will make up the difference in approx 12 months and you will only be in front for years thereafter. I would estimate on your 840L tank in Melbourne that your annual heating bill for 2 x chinese heaters would be around $100. It is difficult to say exactly how much you might save with the Jaeger, however the Germans never make false claims with their products. I would estimate you would save somewhere between $25 and $50 annually with the Jager 300w. Thiese savings are per annum ! Everyone with any size tank can make serious savings with Jager heaters ! ← So your saying 1 x 300W Jeager heater will outperform 2 x 250W el cheapo's? I'd always just figured the wattage rating between heaters was basically equivelant to their output regardless of brand, but the more expensive heaters were just more reliable and accurate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bijengum Posted January 9, 2006 Share Posted January 9, 2006 300 watts is 300 watts whether it comes out of a Chinese or German heater. The quality is the difference - although I've had the same problems with so called "good quality" heaters as with the cheaper ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 As David says, 300 watts is 300 watts, 2 x 250 watts is 500 watts total wihich = more heating power. It's the efficiency of the the heating delivery and the resulting power consumption where you get the benefit. Although, Jager have had their share of problems in past few years (which is quite rare for a German made product) I would expect that they have fixed the problem by now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hardb0iled Posted January 10, 2006 Author Share Posted January 10, 2006 All good info, thanks guys I have puchased the 2 x 250W stainless heaters, I'll see how they go. If they are working too hard on the 840L tank, I have a 450L tank with a sump that they should be perfect for so they wont be wasted Who has the best prices for Jager heaters? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 300 watts is 300 watts whether it comes out of a Chinese or German heater. The quality is the difference - although I've had the same problems with so called "good quality" heaters as with the cheaper ones. ← usually powered devices loose efficency due to loosing power through radiated light or heat so yeah, 300W is 300W. But from my reading, the cheapies switch on & off during the heating cycle even when their temp hasn't been reached. So therefore the tank gets to cool & reheat every so often (moreso than with the thermostat alone) so this is where the better ones might heat better & cost less to run. Make sense? That's what was written in the destructions of one of my tronic heaters anyway, sounds plausable to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted January 10, 2006 Share Posted January 10, 2006 www.aquaticlifeaquariums.com.au have the Jager at around $56 (less 10% if you join for free). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tas_Dean Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 The 250W "cheapies" that HardBoiled is talking about are stainless steel heaters controlled by an external thermostat with a sensor in the tank. I have two of the 300W ones in my 650L tank, and although it is only summer we have had some cold nights here and they have not had a problem at all (in fact, they have hardly been on). As for efficiency... The heaters are suspended in a substance of high thermal conductivity. The actual heating coils (which are the parts that can create Light which radiates heat) are in Stainless steel. Stainless steel is not the best thermal conductor, but is far better than glass. Therefore, any light (radiant heat) will heat the stainless steel, which is submerged in water. There is little, to no, inefficiency. All of the power is producing heat. The question I ask? How can one 300 watt heater be more effective(efficient) in a large tank than 2 250w heaters? The only one way this can happen is if the one 300w rated heater is using more than 500 w of power. Therefore, the heater is exceeding its rating. (which incidentally, is illegal) 300w of power is 300w of power. There are no free rides. As all of the tank heaters I have seen operate on the same principle (resistive coils heating up), for a given rating (assuming the rating is accurate), there can not be a measurable difference in efficiency. It is true that undersized heaters cost more to run. (this is purely to do with the amount of time they run for). The only other difference can be in the method of temperature control. Some heaters might use what is called a simmerstat as opposed to a thermostat. From what Ash has said, it sounds like his Tronic uses a simmerstat. A simmerstat is a less efficient method of temperature control, but much cheaper to manufacture. HTH. Cheers, Dean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuckmeister Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 The question I ask? How can one 300 watt heater be more effective(efficient) in a large tank than 2 250w heaters? The Jagar Heaters are much longer and I believe thicker as well giving a much bigger surface area to work with while still maintaining 300w of power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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