Luckfish123 Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 On another fish forum i was accused of being cruel for the method i used in killing a very sick fish. So after i read peoples opinions on this forum & plenty of others & getting confusing results i contacted the RSPCA. After conversing with a very helpfull rspca Vet & getting their veiws on the subject,they have decided to put an article on their website. Here is the link http://www.petalia.com.au/Templates/StoryT...h&story_no=1885 Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMill Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 I would argue that freezing (chilling) is not inhumane. Because fish are poikilothermic, reduction in temperature will result in reduced metabolism until death occurs. The fish will be dead long before freezing starts to occur. Interestingly, freezing is the preferred method of cane toad euthanasia by the Queensland EPA (I guess slightly above golf clubs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Other Ed Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 A hot topic this one has been. I have never Euthanased (sp?) a fish. However if I did I would get some almost freezing water with ice and salt (to lower the freezing point) and pop the poor bugger in and hold him under whilst saying a small prayer for us both. Others prefer slaming them into a hard surface e.g wall or ground. Another method for quick and messy is under a brick, no suffering, but messy. Ed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r.d.m Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 of course the australian vetenary association are going to reccomend a vet killing your fish! the vet will charge you $65 for the privilage,i reckon the freezer is the go, but ive also heard that sparkling mineral water is very quick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducksta Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Any fisherman who eats their catch fresh will attest that fish who have been badly stressed after capture don't taste as good. The stress makes their body produce some kind of hormone which makes them taste different. The best 2 methods IMO of killing a fish quickly and "stress free" (for the fish) would be an ice slurry, and a fillet knife to the spine just below the head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 I just put them in a plastic bag and into the freezer. What about the way fishermen treat fish and then people eat them. What does the RSPCA say about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gav Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 looked to me like they recommended quite a few ways, not just using a vet. they just suggested a vet was, obviously, ideal. but when veterinary research shows this Freezing fish is also a slow way to die and is not considered humane since the fish is not rendered rapidly insensible to pain and distress. I can't see how anyone can justify killing a fish in a freezer based on what is said in that link. its not that difficult at all to stun a fish then decapitate it. or if you are slightly queasy about that use the ice slurry method as below as suggested by bimbo in this thread ice slurry. this is probably the best way as it is quick and easy and INSTANT if done properly. just get a container and fill it with ice. add enough water so thet the ice can move freely. add a reasonably amount of salt and mix it about. then get the fish and plunge it into the mix making sure it is full immersed. Death is caused by thermal shock in this case not but slowing metabloism which takes a long time and in my mind is not as humane. this is what we use at work to chill fish for market. 800gm silver perch will last only seconds in the mix so unless your fish is a monster this will do the trick. with the amount of time euthanasia comes up we almost need a sticky subject for it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducksta Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Surely somebody is compiling it ll into the ForumFAQ at least? Thats 2 active euheasia threads this week by my count Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMill Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 You can find a website endorsing any point of view as "evidence". I simply dont beleive the RSPCA would have sufficient detailed fish knowledge to make a judgement that freezing is inhumane. In my opinion they have simply taken their boilerplate fluffy kitten policy, and applied it to a fish, which is apples & oranges. From the University of Washington Approved Animal Use Policies (Euthanasia of Fish Species): "Because tropical fish species, (i.e. zebrafish, medaka, and platyfish), have minimal to no physiologic adaptation mechanism for adjusting to cold (4°C) water, cooling to 4°C should be considered an acceptable method of euthanasia since the rapid decrease in temperature from 26°C (or higher) to 4°C induces rapid loss of consciousness and is lethal to these species. Fish euthanized by this method should not come in direct contact with the ice, because this may cause thermal burns and induce pain, but rather the ice should be added to a lowered amount of water for a contact time of 20 minutes." Cheers Troy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gav Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Troy, I think the key point in your quote is rapid decrease in temperature from 26°C (or higher) to 4°C induces rapid loss of consciousness and is lethal to these species I am against putting the fish in the freezer as it is far from rapid. thus my quote on the ice slurry method which is extremely rapid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMill Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Yeah good point. I'm still not of the opinion that a small tropical fish would experience any pain in the time taken for water to drop 22 degrees in a freezer. Have no problems with the slurry method, just personally dont feel it is necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducksta Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Troy get a 500ml coke bottle, fill it with tank water at 25-26 degrees and drop it in the freezer. Check it in 6 hours and tell me what temp the water is. You may be surprised just how drawn out the freezing process is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mezzacam Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Well i personally try not to let me fish get to the stage where i have to kill them But i use the Splat method.. Put the fish in a plastic bag and bam bam bam on the ground 3 times, check it's dead then into the freezer the fish goes in the bag until garbage day. Cameron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 With larger fish, can you just take their head clean off with a meat cleaver? I mean when you have 30cm+ of fish, it takes a pretty big blow to the head to actually stun them enough to stop flopping around, so could you just skip the stun step & take their head clean off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducksta Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Absolutely Ash! IMO that is by far the better method, but many don't have the stomach to just take the head clean off a pet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyfish Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Ive never liked the idea of putting fish in the freezer!! Way to slow in my opinion, Im with Ash on this one To me its the same as drowning something that breaths air only the opposite, as everyone knows fish dont breath air Cheers Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 You buggers sure are a sadistic lot. I hope none of you have cats, dogs or rabbits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Morelia Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 What about the way fishermen treat fish and then people eat them. What does the RSPCA say about that. You are being very general with this post, Nigel. Remember that not all fishermen are fumble-fingered fools who put their [dry]grubby hands all over fish, and then expect them to live when thrown back in with most of their mucous removed. (SHAME REX HUNT, YOU STUPID OLD *clears throat* ) I only rarely eat any fish i catch, and if i do plan to eat something i catch, i just use a quick downward slice behind the head with a good sharp knife, and it's all over. Bashing larger fish doesn't work well. I have a lot of experience killing carp, as i will NOT just leave them to die painfuly on the bank like most. IMO, the quickest way to kill larger aquarium fish, would be with a brick. Also, IMO, if you don't have the compassion to rid an animal of it's pain and suffering, then you should NOT be keeping them as pets. my 2c worth. Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r.d.m Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 daniel, i think the idea is to put the fish in water,then put it in the freezer,not having it thrashing about in the chicken nuggets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyfish Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 lol, thats not the way ive seen people do it! they usually put the fish straight into a bag then in the freezer, thats the only reason i never liked the idea, maybe they didnt know what they were doing! I stil preffer the meatclever!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Morelia Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 You buggers sure are a sadistic lot. I hope none of you have cats, dogs or rabbits. Nah, it's too hard to hold them still and hold a brick at the same time. JUST KIDDING Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMill Posted September 16, 2004 Share Posted September 16, 2004 Yeah ducksta..it does take ages to freeze. But I know from lots of experience that chilling warm beer to a drinkable temperature does not! You dont need to freeze a tropical fish to kill it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pride Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 I had a severum that needed to be put out of its misery. The wife wasn't keen on me bashing it with her meat tenderer so I put an icecream container in the fridge for an hour until the top of the water was icey. I then just dropped in the severum and he instantly floated over on his sided not moving at all. Seemed painless? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pride Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 ooops I meant freezer not fridge!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducksta Posted September 17, 2004 Share Posted September 17, 2004 The question is though, why was the beer ever warm in the first place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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