Bruce Posted February 13, 2007 Author Share Posted February 13, 2007 I asked the company to do diagonal struts but they didn't put them in and still charged me the same price I only just realised after they'd left. I can't have more struts as the sump won't go in then. Also, the metal is 50mm angle. Like I said, a shop near me has an 8'x3x'2.5' on a similar stand, I have a stronger base though. The stand was designed by a structural engineer. Bruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscarmanalpha Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 G'day Bruce, The kill rust or similar paint is a very good idea, especially around the welds. Once the ply is placed on the back and sides and the pine has been securely screwed\bolted in place, including the ply across the top and which I assume will also be securely attached. Are you going to have ply along the bottom as a base for the sump ect...? If so this will further strengthen your stand. As for the shop you have seen the stand in, they also have a taller one than the 8ft stand. And it is strong and large enough to hold a 12'x4'x2' with ease. If you model the stand closely to the one you refer to it should be able to hold a fully laden Sydney bus... Just my 2 cents worth. Cheers, Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tunnel Rat Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 3mm Angle Not painting Rat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazza Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 you could put more bracing on the front but near the centre upright so you could still get the sump in. Even though you have 50mm angle, its still only 3mm thick and 1.5 tonne of glass, rock and water is scary. The people who made your stand should be able to tell you if it was designed for the weight involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Posted February 14, 2007 Author Share Posted February 14, 2007 They said the design was fine and it should be able to hold the weight ok. Bruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skippy Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 They said the design was fine and it should be able to hold the weight ok. Bruce Get it in writing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phenomena Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 The manufacturer maybe dead set right about your stand but I'm still very nervous. Your stand is also taller than mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve24cro Posted February 14, 2007 Share Posted February 14, 2007 Yeh I am a little sceptical about this build, not trying to get you worried or anything. I would have had the legs built out of tubular steel of at least 5mm guage. The whole thing should really be built from 50mm, 5 - 6mm guage tubular steel with diaganol supports too. Maybe you could have gotten the sump in through the front on an angle? I may be wrong there. 3mm angle bars for the entire frame seems little underdone to me. The plywood sides may stop it from twisting, its hard to tell though. Thats just my opinion as 1.5 tons is fairly heavy, even though it is spread out on a large surface area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huzzy Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 1500kg is not spread over a large surface area really.....its spread between 6 verticals. So each 3mm vertical needs to support 250kg, and in addition resist bowing. My biggest concern is that if something fails, such as a weld or a leg bows, its not going to be slow. The thing is going to come slicing down like a guillotine in a matter of split seconds. But hey, its your tank. You have seen and touched this stand, we havent. You know best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cainam Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 So each 3mm vertical needs to support 250kg, and in addition resist bowing. My biggest concern is that if something fails, such as a weld or a leg bows, its not going to be slow. The thing is going to come slicing down like a guillotine in a matter of split seconds. But hey, its your tank. You have seen and touched this stand, we havent. You know best. ime a boilermaker huzzy and not bein smart or anythin,,but 50 x 3mm rhs is heaps strong enough for that stand,,,,its strength is in how its used and theres no way it can buckle or crush from that amount of weight,,,,just my 2 cents, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Posted February 15, 2007 Author Share Posted February 15, 2007 Thanks cainam, really good to hear someone in the steel area's point of view. And also a positive comment doesn't hurt Bruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod54 Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 I agree with cainam...It wont buckle or crush....but What will the distortion be of the top angle....every structure distorts....some can be structurally sound with a lot of distortion.... A tank stand needs to be very stiff....not a lot of distortion I'd add 4 more hardwood (70x50) posts loosely fitted mid span...2 front and 2 back.....add the front ones after the sump is in....I'll bet they will be a very tight fit by the time the tank is filled....but hey if not just take them out? This would give you just a little bit of insurance and not a lot of cost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve24cro Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 I hope I didnt sound too negative, I was just watching out for you and your project! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cainam Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 I agree with cainam...It wont buckle or crush....but What will the distortion be of the top angle....every structure distorts....some can be structurally sound with a lot of distortion.... A tank stand needs to be very stiff....not a lot of distortion I'd add 4 more hardwood (70x50) posts loosely fitted mid span...2 front and 2 back.....add the front ones after the sump is in....I'll bet they will be a very tight fit by the time the tank is filled....but hey if not just take them out? This would give you just a little bit of insurance and not a lot of cost yeah u r right rod it can distort from the heat in the welding,,,,but,,,,any boilermaker or at least whoever made it can just as easily get it straight by heating opposite side of the weld,,,thats what ide do anyway,,can get it pretty close and any differences would be minimum,,,( the foam under the glass would take care of it ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod54 Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 I agree with cainam...It wont buckle or crush....but What will the distortion be of the top angle....every structure distorts....some can be structurally sound with a lot of distortion.... A tank stand needs to be very stiff....not a lot of distortion I'd add 4 more hardwood (70x50) posts loosely fitted mid span...2 front and 2 back.....add the front ones after the sump is in....I'll bet they will be a very tight fit by the time the tank is filled....but hey if not just take them out? This would give you just a little bit of insurance and not a lot of cost yeah u r right rod it can distort from the heat in the welding,,,,but,,,,any boilermaker or at least whoever made it can just as easily get it straight by heating opposite side of the weld,,,thats what ide do anyway,,can get it pretty close and any differences would be minimum,,,( the foam under the glass would take care of it ) I understand what you are saying....but I'm talking about distortion under load of the tank full of water...not during construction No post in the middle....Big distortion and most likely tank failure! one post/2 spans(as constructed).....less distortion and tank failure...possible?? 2 posts/3 spans....less distortion again...tank failure unlikely 3 posts/4 spans(my suggestion)....distortion would be negligable...tank failure most unlikely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huzzy Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 No post in the middle....Big distortion and most likely tank failure! one post/2 spans(as constructed).....less distortion and tank failure...possible?? 2 posts/3 spans....less distortion again...tank failure unlikely 3 posts/4 spans(my suggestion)....distortion would be negligable...tank failure most unlikely You should write those "Windows for Dummies" books. That was laid out so nicely, with little emoticons at the end of each point to give the illiterate a scale of how sound each idea was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cainam Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 no mate,,,,there wont be any distortion,,,,its plenty strong enough as it is,,,,full of water or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cainam Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 no mate,,,,there wont be any distortion,,,,its plenty strong enough as it is,,,,full of water or not. sry wasnt very clear.....the weight is evenly distributed on the top of the frame and the legs under it is enough to hold the weight of the tank full easily....ide be happy with it just as it is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Posted February 15, 2007 Author Share Posted February 15, 2007 Thanks guys. Got some "True Bite, Anti-corrosive Universal Metal Primer" off a friend. Should I paint the welds or most of the stand? Bruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 All of it Bruce. Jack it up and do the underside also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod54 Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 no mate,,,,there wont be any distortion,,,,its plenty strong enough as it is,,,,full of water or not. sry wasnt very clear.....the weight is evenly distributed on the top of the frame and the legs under it is enough to hold the weight of the tank full easily....ide be happy with it just as it is No worries....perhaps you are right....mighty big mess and a lot of $$$$ lost if you are wrong I'm just suggesting a simple insurance policy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cainam Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 No worries....perhaps you are right....mighty big mess and a lot of $$$$ lost if you are wrong I'm just suggesting a simple insurance policy... mate,,,been a boilermaker 25 years,,it will be ok as it is,,,more than enough,,,,,and yeah bruce,,paint as much of it as u can,all would be best,,,primer u have should be ok,,then use a good quality enamel paint,,,, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obsessed1 Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 Its all looking great Bruce! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod54 Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 1500kg is not spread over a large surface area really.....its spread between 6 verticals. So each 3mm vertical needs to support 250kg, and in addition resist bowing. My biggest concern is that if something fails, such as a weld or a leg bows, its not going to be slow. The thing is going to come slicing down like a guillotine in a matter of split seconds. But hey, its your tank. You have seen and touched this stand, we havent. You know best. Just for the record....the center 2 posts support Half the load(450kg/post)....the posts at end support a quarter of the load each(225kg/post)...it's a mistake to think the load is even caninam....Sorry if I've casted dispersions on your trade or experience that is not my intention My advise has been given in Good faith as are the majority of posts on this subject and if you read mine carefully...they just provide Bruce with a simple way to ensure he has no problems regardless of who is right. ...a bit of risk management. Hopefully Bruce understands this ....even if you don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cainam Posted February 16, 2007 Share Posted February 16, 2007 1500kg is not spread over a large surface area really.....its spread between 6 verticals. So each 3mm vertical needs to support 250kg, and in addition resist bowing. My biggest concern is that if something fails, such as a weld or a leg bows, its not going to be slow. The thing is going to come slicing down like a guillotine in a matter of split seconds. But hey, its your tank. You have seen and touched this stand, we havent. You know best. Just for the record....the center 2 posts support Half the load(450kg/post)....the posts at end support a quarter of the load each(225kg/post)...it's a mistake to think the load is even caninam....Sorry if I've casted dispersions on your trade or experience that is not my intention My advise has been given in Good faith as are the majority of posts on this subject and if you read mine carefully...they just provide Bruce with a simple way to ensure he has no problems regardless of who is right. ...a bit of risk management. Hopefully Bruce understands this ....even if you don't. get a piece of 50 x 50 x 3 mm square tube mate,,,900 long,,,,stand it straight up,,,,and see just how much wieght it takes to even get a dent in it,,,,,ulle find its alot more than 450 kilos,,,,but,,,do as u like,,was just sayin its plenty strong enough,,,,,,(in my opinion),,, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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