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catcher

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Hi All

This has turned into a seriously good thread smile.gif

For those interested in ceramic noodles try

K.C. Industries on 97979844 and ask about ceramic insulators

Hi Mianos

Looking forward to more info on Diatomite tests it sounds very promising

from your posts so far, especially in pricing

Hi Daryl

My only worry with Zeolite is the way it recharges and the possible release

of what it has absorbed if contacting salt compared to an inert media

L2H

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hey everyone,

Just to add one more item to this great post, (Mianos, L2H and Craig) you guys should find this interesting. I followed up on the Diatomite and rang the NSW mine company it comes from, was put onto the Sydney rep and asked a few questions. The rep said Diatomite is not really the one to use but Zeolite is. They have already trialed it with a number of fish keeping people and all tests have come back trumps. He going to send me some info via email. Basic price 25kg's, 20 - 25 bucks, woohoo. Compared to name brand stuff, not bad at all. It also comes in all grades from super fine to course. He said they are testing feeding it to fish to remove impurities in the very fine grades, apparently it cleans up whats needed then passes through. Weird aye !

I'll pass on the info if anyone is interested when I get it.

Cheers

Glenn

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From what I have understood about the differences between diatomite and Zeolite, is that diatomite is really only a biological media, where as Zeolite has in addition some chemical filtration properties. If this is correct, I would think that dependant on your end use, will dictate which may be better for you. And that Zeolite may have the disadvantage of becoming “full” or somehow releasing back into your tank the toxins it has captured. Comparing apples with apples, I would think the Zeolite would have a greater surface area, and be better for biological purposes due to this.

I would think that for use in the wet/dry (this was the reason for this thread after all), the diatomite would be most suitable, provided the particle sizes used are similar to the efisubstrat.

There was a product that was put out by a company now bust (in America) called “Cellpor”. It never came to Oz, but it’s main claim to fame, was that you could buy it in sheets/slabs (for use as a barrier in a sump style filter), or in a lump that you could carve into some sort of fanciful rock shape. Due to the thickness of this, one gained an anaerobic area within your tank that was able to take out nitrates. I would think that if you could get this diatomite in lumps (after all it is quarried), then you could do similar.

Just a thought.

Craig

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Guest big bad burundi

Hi Daryl

My only worry with Zeolite is the way it recharges and the possible release

of what it has absorbed if contacting salt compared to an inert media

L2H

The problem you have understanding my theory is you are too quick to assume there is high level of ammonia to start with.

Surface area is what its all about with my idea of my home made filtration.

Re-usabilty of the media also made the decision very easy for me to make.

Yes there would be ammonia in the system, well there is a trace but that is all there ever is.

Simply my water in pond is crystal clear and if i was to put 2 glasses of water in front of you to choose from,youd drink the wrong glass because the water from pond is clearer than from our tap.

Now that dont say much for our water supplier mad.gif ,but ive never been a fan of departments that lie for a living. blink.gif

Cheers

Darryl

Ps:If you care for a sample i could send you some Chris.

I have Mark at Aggies using it and his tanks have brightened up since its been getting used in my oppinion. rolleyes.gif

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Hi,

very nice thread going here. Anyway, i wonder how well zeolite and diatomite may work as a planted tank substrate? i know this isnt the section but i thought someone may know something about it. I know diatomite is used in most kitty litters here in Australia, and there are many reports of Kitty litter being a good substrate. Problem with Kitty litter is that it usually isnt baked much so it absors water and eventually turns mushy, but if u can buy cheaply hard baked stuff as u are mentioning, that would be great!

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Guest big bad burundi

The mineral I am on about is used in many applications commercially from waste water management through to and including stock feed supplement .Amongst those different ways being used is also used as a medium in horticultural uses for example hydroponics. It can absorb nutrients which can be used later by what ever cares to feed upon them ie: nitrates which a plant will consume whilst growing vigorously so why couldnt it work for your purpose.

Nitrifying bacteria which will feast upon the ammonia and multiply cleansing as they grow is what I thought. rolleyes.gif

Hey its working for me and im very happy with all the results. wub.gif

Cheers

Darryl

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I primarily user this stuff for growing orchids. The Maidenwell diatomite is fired. I use the fine grade for seedlings and it never goes to mush like kitty litter, even though it looks just like it, even after years (which makes it reusable). However it's not very dense, being very porus and mainly air, so it would not stay on the bottom. Even the 1cm size bits are moved all arround the bottom by bottom feeders. You do have to wash it very well before you use it as the fine grade seems to have a lot of dust in it (and the dust is not good for you so be carfefull).

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I rang a few numbers and spoke with a geologist who is professionally connected to both Diatomite, and Zeolite.

Diatomite will break down in water unless you purchase it in “calcine” form.

It all got quite complicated and difficult to gain a conclusive understanding, due to it not being known conclusively how these product will interact with our aquariums (bacteria). But in regards to Zeolite, it will work as a chemical filtration absorbing such things as ammonia (as I think Link to Hell mentioned). It is “cleaned” by putting it through a bath of sodium (salt). It can’t be used in marine tanks for this reason, and so to me, if it was used in a tank with Rift salts, it may also not be useable.

What was being looked for with this thread, was a biological media, whereas Zeolite seems to primarily be a chemical media. However it was also mentioned that there may be a possibility of the aerobic bacteria (existing on/in the Zeolite) “intercepting” the ammonia as it is drawn to the Zeolite, and in effect, once the bacteria equals the ammonia being produce, will effectively prevent the Zeolite from becoming saturated (my conclusion). This conclusion is extrapolated out from the geologist comments, as he wasn’t technically qualified to know how the Zeolite and bacteria will coexist with the ammonia in our tanks. I don’t know for example, if the bacteria are able to break down the ammonia to nitrite in/on the Zeolite, will the Zeolite absorb this as it does to ammonia. And if it does, will the bacteria that break down nitrate, be able to access it if the Zeolite absorb it?

They have offered me a free bag of both Diatomite and Zeolite, which is very nice of them.

Craig

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Craig,

what do you use as test pilots for this type of experiment if you go ahead, and how long do you think results either way would be recognised?

glenn

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Criag, if you also want a couple of litres of coarse grade Maidenwell diatomite and you are going past the city I'll give you some to try for an experiment.

(You didn't by chance talk to Col from Maidenwell?)

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Catcher,

Not sure what I would do to test it out as I haven’t got any tanks that I could “lose” if something went wrong. To be honest, I wouldn’t expect anything to go wrong, but how would I compare “apples with apples”?

Mainos, thanks for the offer, but I will not have the time to come city bound. I spoke with a Daniel and a Michael, both contacted from the link that was included further up by yourself.

Craig

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zeolite acts as a catalyst... it cannot as such be "filled" as a catalyst in theory is the same at the end of the process as at the beginning... from this point of view I would use zeolite...

Even when these chemical properties are exhausted (as was said earlier)... the zeolite can be "recharged" in brine... this however would kill the bacteria.... ande should not be needed

It also has a much higher surface area so that bacteria can aid in the waste conversion process...

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craig,

If you get a "chunk" of zeolite would you just pop it in the tank or put it in a sump? I'm assuming for Ammonia removal? glenn

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