How To Soak Food in Medication.

[CThompson]

Saw a comment on another thread that has prompted me to write down the following information;

This method works wether you are soaking food in a water and liquid medication solution or a water and a crushed tablet solution.

The main trick is to use the correct amount of water, with the amount of food you are feeding.

I find/feel that pellets (and crushed pellets) are better for a type of food than a flake.

Put in a small/appropriate amount of water into a container, add your liquid medication and/or a garlic flavour enhancer (optional but this can help to make palatable a food that has been made to taste a bit crook due to the chemicals you are trying to get inside your fish) such as Garlic Guard. Swish to mix, and now add your food. The idea is if you get this liquid and solid mix right, so that after about ten or so minutes, all the liquid (medication/Garlic Guard and all) has been soaked into the food.

When you first put the food in, you want the mix to be too wet, as if you have gotten the percentages correct, this excess medicated water will be drawn in to the food.

In the case of tablets that have been crushed, follow the same above procedure (including adding Garlic Guard if you want), but be aware that the particles that don’t dissolve (there will probably be lots), will stick to the outside of the food particles, and hopefully some of it will get to the targeted tummies. You will see crushed tablet particles in the water when you feed, but I feel this is no great issue, and some of this may be ingested also.

Remember, the idea is to get the liquid to food ratio correct, and to not have this mixture sitting around too long (where you may lose vitamins from the food). In the case of medicating extremely ill fish (live food is a big tempter here if they are not eating well), I’d put priority on getting the medicated food inside the fish as more important than a few vitamins they may miss out on anyway. But if the food is soaked quickly, there should be no loss anyway.

I have used a vartiation on this method to soak live food in too, such as wrigglers and daphnia for example, but you will have to have just enough water so they can still swim. Also, leave the medicated water/live food mix sitting longer so the live food can ingest some of the medication, and still be alive once you add them to the tank. Once added to the tank insect larvae such as wrigglers will have medication stuck to their bodies too, so any that are immediately eaten should have a good coating on them.

I have also done similar with frozen food, using medications such as Metronidazole, and refreezing the food once mixed.

Craig

[m0oks]

Very helpfuL,thanks Craig

[yellow]

craig when medicating fish using this method how you determine dosage rates?

[CThompson]

craig when medicating fish using this method how you determine dosage rates?

That is a real “how long is a piece of string" question. Pleased to see you read what I wrote well enough to pose it.

With some medications, for example I’m pretty sure, such as Metro, it comes with a little spoon, and some brief guidelines, such as; “one little spoon [enclosed] to one tablespoon/teaspoon of frozen food”, or similar. So read your bottle first to try and get an idea.

If you’ve got a tablet, for example I am currently dosing my big tank with some worm rid and clout, so I cut the tablet into four, do several at a time, and crush (between two spoons) a ¼ tablet for use, for each use.

A further question to yours would be; “how long should you dose for?”, as this is just as valid as “how much?”

I tend to find with an issue such as wasting, that I will keep dosing, possibly changing the medication without stopping till I see improvement. Is this the wrong way to do it (try and find an answer to that question)?

I think it is relevant to point out that when you dose a tank and you dose the water, you will be using vastly more of what ever medication than if you dose just their food, and dosing the food will get the medication where it needs to be for fish with internal problems.

If I used say a ¼ tablet, and say a dozen individual pieces of NLS, then clearly, this will be too much as the dozen pieces can’t possibly soak up all the medication, even if you used the right amount of water.

If you have a decent amount of food, but you have it so heavily soaked with medicine that the fish won’t eat it, then I’d say you’ve used too much. I have incidentally put too much Garlic Guard and the fish wouldn’t touch it…

None of what I have written I have gotten from books. Even vets will have little knowledge in this area (“fishy fishy fishy”), so what I have detailed should be read without disengaging your own intelligence. But it has been learned from observation and experience, it is a bit of an ‘art’ which will be guided with experience.

Did that answer your question?

Craig

[Ash]

so say if you had 200mg Flagyl/Metro tablets meant for human consumption, how do you figure out the dose from that?

[CThompson]

I've got the same tablets at home too. As yet I have not gone down the road to using them, but to give you a yard stick, try using a 1/4 tablet crushed with say .....gezzz, what measure do you use to indicate amount of food? How about crushed 1/4 tablet with ......1/4 to 1/3 level teaspoon of NLS?

I should add to be wary of any human medications that have colorants or flavours added to them. Not such a problem with tablets, but still something to be aware of.

The idea of my adding my “how to dose food” comments was so that people could extrapolate out for themselves from a base understanding, and work out what is suitable for their circumstance/s. I haven’t seen your fish, nor know their numbers, tank size, species, what you are currently feeding your fish or even what other attempts you have made to fix the issue – or even if there is an issue .

For example dosing food with any medication of any sort to treat white spot is clearly not going to work.

So by all means, take on board what I have detailed, but don’t disengage your brain . I think illness and medication is THE most difficult arrow to master in our aquarium quiver. I know it is for me, as I am far from where I’d like to be .

Craig

[Ash]

Well I aquired the tablets as a "just in case" thing after I lost my texas pair to what has been suggested to be a bacterial infection, I'd just never known how to use them & in that case they went off their food so it wouldn't have helped anyway.

I'd be interested to know how many mg are in each of those scoops of metro you referred to eariler - it would give me an accurate dosage rate to aim for with the tabs (ie: if the scoop is 50mg then 1/4 tablet is the go)

[huzzy]

To my knowledge, you cannot overdose with Metro.

However DiMetro you can, and even with correct doses it apparently kills your good bacteria.

[CThompson]

name='Ash' date='Mar 23rd 2007 @ 09:05 ' post='194448']

Well I aquired the tablets as a "just in case" thing after I lost my texas pair to what has been suggested to be a bacterial infection, I'd just never known how to use them & in that case they went off their food so it wouldn't have helped anyway.

That is when I'd be thinking to use live food. Maybe it doesn't work either, if not, then you'll have to look at dosing the water, in which case your tablets are not suitable.

I'd be interested to know how many mg are in each of those scoops of metro you referred to eariler - it would give me an accurate dosage rate to aim for with the tabs (ie: if the scoop is 50mg then 1/4 tablet is the go)

This is not rocket science, if you can get something into them, a little too much, not quite enough, its inside. The worst that can happen is the fish may die, which is what is going to happen if you don't try and fix the fish anyway.

The scoops of metro I referred to are relative to the Metronidazole that Seachem sell, not for Metro, produced for human consumption. I'll see if I can find further information off the bottle.

[huzzy]

The scoops of metro I referred to are relative to the Metronidazole that Seachem sell, not for Metro, produced for human consumption. I'll see if I can find further information off the bottle.

I have the Metro for Human consumption. Its the 200mg and I dose at 200mg/35Litres when i add directly to the tank.

[Ash]

What form is that in huzzy? powder, tablet or liquid?

[huzzy]

Tablets Ash.

I crush it with the back of a spoon, then stir with water in a glass until 99% disolved and then add to tank.

I will be getting 500mg tablets in the next week or two in bulk...once i know prices I will sell it for what it costs me. Again, these will be metro, not dimetro.

[CThompson]

Instructions on a bottle of Metronidazole;

"Metronidazole is an effective and safe treatment for several protozoan and anaerobic bacterial diseases of fish. It does not adversely affect the filter bed and is easily removed with carbon. There is little danger of overdosing. Usual dose is 125 mg/10 gallons. Turn off UV and ozone.

Directions: Use 1-2 measures (each about 100 mg) for every 10 gallons. To feed, blend 1 measure with about 1 tablespoon of frozen food paste. Food may be refrozen.”

[Ash]

cheers Craig, that sorts me out

[rosco]

I have been using Metro to treat Dubosi (I had one instance of bloat now I am treating the rest to ensure it does not spread across the colony). I have been using half a tablet (Metro 200mg per tablet) to 1 teaspoon of food using the soaking method that the Craig initially suggested. These guys are still on HBH flake so I had to use flake. Touchwood I not seen anymore instances of bloat and all appear to happy and eating and I am on dat 5 of the treatment. I will continue for 3 more days and then watch it from there.

I have also been feeding this to the fish that I mentioned with concave bellies with little or no suiccess. I have lost one fish but the other while holding on is looking ragged. I may try a more aggressive treatment as he is in a smaller tank.

cheers

rosco