brayschout Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 Hey guys. So over the next few months I'll be upgrading from my standard 4 foot to a 5x2x2. I will be running a sump on the new set-up, however as I have only really had experience with canisters I was after your suggestions and thoughts as to: - what size sump is required, - What size pump would be best for the return, - sump set-up/layout and , - the best media that you'd all recommend for the sump. I'm here to learn from all of your years of experience so please fire away! Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humbug Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 A few of my thoughts As a starting point, I work on sump volume roughly 30% of tank volume. Depending on your plumbing etc, you may get away with a bit less. Go bigger if you have room, as that will give you more options with sump design. There is no “right” design for a sump. There are some great resources on the internet explaining how to calculate sump size, overflow volume etc. Also a zillion examples of designs. Best bet is to spend the time to read as much as you can to work out what’s best for your particular requirementsI find placing media in media bags makes cleaning far easier. Perhaps take that into consideration when sizing the chambers in the sump. I’m also using a large block of Marine Pure in a low flow area of a couple of my sumps for nitrate reduction, and are very impressed with the results. If that’s something that interests you, you might want to include that in your design. Consider a compartment which can’t run dry to house your heater. In choosing a pump, have a look at some of the highly energy-efficient pumps available. Remember your pump is running 24hours a day, every day, so power consumption adds up. As to media – there is a hell of a lot of hype on the subject. People will argue for hours about which is “most efficient” or which is “best”. Reality is, all your media is doing is providing surface area for bacteria to colonise. Providing you have more than enough surface area to support enough bacteria to cope with your bio-load, then it doesn’t really matter what that media is. Sumps make things easy – plenty of room to house lots of media, so it’s not essential for that media to have a really high surface area to volume ratio. I personally use a whole range of media in my sumps / canisters / side-drops; Marine Pure, Matrix, K1, cheap noodles from Asia, aquaponics expanded-earth, etc, etc. Some of it I’ve bought. Some of it I’ve inherited with second-hand gear. It all works. My recommendation is to see what’s on special at the time you are looking to buy, or see what deals you can find on the second-hand market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brayschout Posted September 25, 2017 Author Share Posted September 25, 2017 Thanks @humbug i greatly apprecite your advice! Ill definintely continue to research as much as i can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
undercoverbrother Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 Kathy has covered most of it. The only recommedation I have is purchase media bags, it will make your life a lot easier when you want/need to clean the sump. I saw these BioPure Balls which may be of interest to you. http://www.aquaholicsonline.com.au/biopro-biopure-aqua-bacteria-house-bio-bakki-balls-5l.html From the link:- " Biopro Piopure Balls are so effective that a single Ball is equivalent to several kilo's of ceramic noodles (more than 10x its weight) or 1000's of bioballs " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brayschout Posted September 26, 2017 Author Share Posted September 26, 2017 Thanks @undercoverbrother! Greatly appreciate it! If I was to go with the BioPure Balls rather than standard Bio Balls, would that be more of a suitable option given that they do provide a much greater surface area? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humbug Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 As with so many products marketed for aquarium use (and I suppose everything in our lives) there is a hell of a lot of spin in advertising. Makes it hard to work out what’s what. Generally you get what you pay for. Cheap bio balls are cheap for a reason. They may superficially look like the more expensive Marine Pure, but that doesn’t mean they will work as well. The Tech Den have a good comparison photo on their website which helps to explain the situation – link below. https://www.thetechden.com.au/MarinePure_1_litre_Spheres_22_Spheres_p/900138-1-litre.htm It’s not to say that the cheaper alternative won’t work – it will – but you will need substantially more to support the same bio-load. Nylon pot scrubbers work too, and are very cheap, but again you need a hell of a lot of them to achieve the same thing as the high-end media does. If you have room for a big sump, then this doesn’t matter at all – you have plenty of volume to house large quantities of a less efficient media. But whichever way you go you need to look at it pragmatically. One product may be half the cost of another, but if you need twice as much to do the same job, then you haven’t saved anything. Having more media means more media bags and a bit more work with sump maintenance. Keep your eyes open for specials though. If you aren’t in a hurry to get set-up, every now and then there are really good deals on some of the high-end media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brayschout Posted September 27, 2017 Author Share Posted September 27, 2017 Thank you @humbug! I think ill definitely be going with the Marine Pure, the comparison is definitely the best way to learn what makes them a superior media to use. Thank you guys for all your advise thus far, I look forward to plenty more to come! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlecoSam Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 Marine pure is good but very fragile, very soft, any rubbing and it will turn to dust. I would not put anything but Marine pure blocks in a sump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humbug Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 I've been running Marine Pure in sumps for around three years now (balls in the main water-flow in the sump, and blocks in low-flow areas). I wouldn't say its broken down any more than other forms of media I've used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlecoSam Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Too fragile to warrant use in a sump, to each their own, I would use it in a canister though and only where space is at a premium. My marine pure was used in canister filters and when cleaning damage would easily occur or I found marine pure dust in places inside the filter where the marine pure was rubbing against each other. The filter blocks I use in my sumps and they support better denitrification over the filter spheres, although I do not see much, if any, nitrate reduction in my setups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brayschout Posted October 24, 2017 Author Share Posted October 24, 2017 Thanks guys! You're most certainly teaching me things I've never really learned about, specifically filtration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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