Donny Brasco Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 Hey guys i have a question for anyone whos able to work out or if they have one of these pumps im after a bit of information....http://www.aquaholicsonline.com.au/ac-dc-automatic-emergency-lithium-backup-aquarium-air-pump-4-outlet.html That is the pump in question, not as i have changed my set up alot recently im wanting to purchase a new air pump for a few functions. 1. as a secondary supply of oxygen to my 5ft display via a sponge filter which will also do a bit of filtering 2. as an air supply to an egg tumbler in a separate 5ft breeder tank 3. the other 2 outlets will be driving 2 x air lifts on an internal filter for a 5ft breeder tank the fact that this is battery back up gives me a little piece of mind that my tanks wont crash if there is a short power outage. What i need to know is are the outputs of these little pumps big enough to do what i need it to do? the egg tumbler of course needs bugger all so thats fine, the sponge filter will be a bit smaller than the normal 380 large so im not to stressed about that, as i wont be using it primarly for filtration more of a water movement incase power goes out. i guess the biggest issue is will it have enough grunt to operate a couple of air lifts? it states that the pump is 4 x 3l/min so 180lph x4 outlets. If i run adjustable valves on each outlet and say restrict a couple of them does that then increase the flow of the other 2 or is it literally 4 separated units? Is there some sort of formula to work out how much flo is needed for an air lift? Sorry for all the questions i just want to make sure i buy the right thing to begin with and this seems perfect as long as it has the grunt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Link2Hell Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 what depth are you pumping to Donny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donny Brasco Posted February 12, 2016 Author Share Posted February 12, 2016 ah good question i guess. the main concern which is the air lifts are in a 18inch high so lets say less water height and a bit i was say 15inches? would it help if i used a smaller size diameter pipe instead of the usual pvc bunnings stuff which i think is either 28 or 32mm im sort of hoping it has enough guts to have some sort of flow out the ends Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donny Brasco Posted February 12, 2016 Author Share Posted February 12, 2016 excuse my silly drawing but this is roughly how its going to be, 5ft long tank 18x18, that filter section will be roughly 1ft so the tank section will be 4ft, i will have 2 x air lifters which suck the water up from the filtered section and then shoot it out into the tank hoping to create a little bit of water disturbance (so that i dont need any other form of water movement) as well as adequate flow for filtration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 I think the output is going to be a little low to run 4 outlets and to keep things safe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perherfile Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Why not try a small computer UPS?, something like this http://cplonline.com.au/ups/eaton-5e-650va-230v-ups-5e650iusb-au.html That's going to run air pumps for, err, quite a long time, after the power goes off. Could also run any other pumps you might want it to. About the same price as the pump you link to but much more flexible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buccal Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 A medium size UPS will run a 5w wavemaker for between 3-4 hours. I had one on my big display, and my area had record amount of power outages, and it served me well, till I hooked the total house power up to a auto start geny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perherfile Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Possibly the fact that I work in IT changes my perspective, but I'd expect something considered medium sized for a UPS to run a 5w wave maker for more than 3 to 4 hours. More like 3 to 4 days A large UPS would be even longer. You could run your heaters off that big one for a while... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buccal Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Yeah don't know about heaters, a small one draws 150w. I don't know if the UPS 8 or so years ago were not as good as ones today maybe,,, it's also possible that a not so good recharbable battery (dud) installed,,, actually I likely had a smaller one rather than a medium one. They have similar ones for actual whole houses (mostly stupid gimmick), Gemmill homes give them out free with every home purchased,,,, just using lights in house they last 3 hours apparently,,, put tele on with something else and it'll get sucked dry in 5-10 mins,,, though it could be wired to supply power to lights only which is a question I should have asked.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donny Brasco Posted February 19, 2016 Author Share Posted February 19, 2016 interesting perherfile i have never seen those before. so essentially i can hook my current haliea 60w air pump into that now and it will run as a battery back up if the power goes out correct? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buccal Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 The idea is, all the computers and hardware is connected to these units which are plugged into power point. If you got hours of work done on your computer, then power goes out, then anything you havnt filed would be lost, hence the unit rapidly cutting in and giving continuation on the computer to save files. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extreoxy Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 18 hours ago, Perherfile said: Possibly the fact that I work in IT changes my perspective, but I'd expect something considered medium sized for a UPS to run a 5w wave maker for more than 3 to 4 hours. More like 3 to 4 days A large UPS would be even longer. You could run your heaters off that big one for a while... OMG yours are huge and expensive I would have though something like this would be more reasonable http://www.scorptec.com.au/product/UPS/UPS/45712-VALUE2200ELCD CyberPower Value SOHO 2200 VA / 1320 Watts UPS $329 against CyberPower Online Series OL10000ERT3UDM 10000VA / 9000W Rackmount UPS $6,842 lol Im not too sure how long these last umm if Power= 10W(per hour) and UPS has 1320 watts then 5.5 days? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buccal Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 Power outages only go for 1-3 hours max in general. You only need a 5w wavemaker or power head to continue oxygen transfer. A 5w wavemaker does my 2000 liter display packed with stock easy,,, just need it cracking the surface well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donny Brasco Posted February 24, 2016 Author Share Posted February 24, 2016 yeah thats right im not looking for something to carry on for days just something to keep a bit of oxygen for a few hours. im thinking i might just get one of those hopar 4 outlet ones and just use them with some air stones, surely that will be enough for a few hours at max Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buccal Posted February 24, 2016 Share Posted February 24, 2016 Yep that's correct,,, but I do regard a small powerhead/wavemaker more effective when comparing watt for watt. I think it cost $180 for a cheap computer backup box or UPS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perherfile Posted February 25, 2016 Share Posted February 25, 2016 On 19/2/2016 at 10:34 PM, Donny Brasco said: interesting perherfile i have never seen those before. so essentially i can hook my current haliea 60w air pump into that now and it will run as a battery back up if the power goes out correct? Exactly. You can plug anything into them so long as you don't exceed the VA/W rating on the unit. In the case of the one I linked to it is 360W (scroll down to read the specs) so your 60W air pump is fine. You use the Ah rating to figure how long it will last: 7Ah in this case. Amps will = W/V so 60/12 = 5, use the battery voltage, not the output voltage. So we are drawing 5 amps, Ah/Amps is how long it will last, 7/5 =1.4 the unit will last for nearly an hour and a half assuming your pump consistently draws the full 60W, truth is it probably will not draw the full 60W and will last longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perherfile Posted February 25, 2016 Share Posted February 25, 2016 On 20/2/2016 at 3:19 PM, extreoxy said: OMG yours are huge and expensive I would have though something like this would be more reasonable http://www.scorptec.com.au/product/UPS/UPS/45712-VALUE2200ELCD CyberPower Value SOHO 2200 VA / 1320 Watts UPS $329 against CyberPower Online Series OL10000ERT3UDM 10000VA / 9000W Rackmount UPS $6,842 lol Im not too sure how long these last umm if Power= 10W(per hour) and UPS has 1320 watts then 5.5 days? No. Watt rating is about the maximum you can draw from the unit at any one time. Look at Ah to figure how long it will last, see my other reply for more on this. The Watt ratings are displayed prominently as these computer UPS systems are designed to give enough power to get everything shut down and ensure zero data loss occurs. The important thing is they can output their max load for just a few minutes. The more expensive ones also come with software that will start the shutdown of computers attached to them if there is a power outage for any arbitrary length of time (30 seconds say.) They are not designed to give a long sustained power output as such, but with small loads they certainly can and can be a cheap way to do so. Be warned they make a lot of noise when the power goes out, they beep like mad (it's so you can hear them off in a server room somewhere, just in case power outage is localised.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buccal Posted February 25, 2016 Share Posted February 25, 2016 Yep, lol, it's like they specifically design the beeping noise to pierce your brain, and get you very annoyed,,,,, same way as smoke alarm beeping, but toned down just a bit,,, they'd all vary tho. Yeah, so all you need is, a domestic personal computer UPS, and go for a cheaper brand and buy a medium size in the range. I went to Arrow computers to get mine, think I spent $220 on one but I almost went for the smaller model $180 or there abouts. Some brands have anywhere between 2-4 sizes of each model. (Choose medium sizes).,,,, but never go over 5w device to keep the jevity hours up,,,, as I made a point of before, a 5w air pump versus a 5w powerhead (not wave maker),,,, the power head would way outperform it, maximum surface to bottom circulation whilst excellent surface aggetation. My 5w powerhead would serve a rough 2500 liters packed with plenty of big fish for 3-4 hours, the fish became slightly less active towards the end only if it were a hot day 30-32'c water. A small slight note,,,, it's good to really have your turnover and oxygenation always set to the max that your set up type can tolerate,,,,,,, this way when power does go out, your water is already holding a high capacity of oxygen,,, this means your 5w powerhead isn't trying to play catch up,, it's more like playing to maintain...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egyptshn Posted October 31, 2016 Share Posted October 31, 2016 I know I am resurrecting an old post here, but thought I would share my experiences with the Hopar LD 10000. I bought nine of them, and eleven months later five don't work. I have contacted the supplier today because there is a 12 month warranty on them. But I hook them up to egg tumblers so that if the power goes down when I am not home I don't lose my eggs/fry. Well........yesterday when I woke up the one on my Ilangi tumbler had failed and I nearly lost 34 Ilangi. My patience has run out, that was the final straw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishdance Posted October 31, 2016 Share Posted October 31, 2016 I've played around with emergency back up to fish quite a bit. By this I mean separate dedicated electrical circuits, automatic transfer switches, 12 volt & 240 volt systems, solar panel sources, phone alerts etc. While each persons perspective differs, and values change as your life journey continues, what I've found to work best for me is: 2 big air pumps to run one central airline loop. Each pump having enough volume to run all tanks but the drop off in volume when one stops is immediately noticable. Having 2 air pumps per air circuit loop is the equivalent of having 2 separate air stones/sponges per tank with less equipment and cost and clutter. Each air pump is run off an inverter which runs off a deep cycle battery which is kept fully charged by a smart charger. These run 24/7 so I know they already work, not hope they come on when needed in emergencies. So I no longer use an ATS even though I used to build my own. I have 400 Ahr capacity deep cycle batteries so if the power fails, they can run my air pumps (70 watts) for several days (tested) before the batteries get to 50%. I keep the same model equipment (air pump, inverter, charger, sponges, valves etc ) to reduce the amount of spare parts needed and also have a spare of everything so hot swapping is easy. One air circuit per 100 tanks because although the back up is extremely robust, mimimising risk is the main objective. On highly stocked and valuable tanks, a separate stand alone system again per tank (such as 12 volt water pump). A cheap mobile with power outage app notifies me even if I'm overseas. Although most of my tanks are centrally filtered, I consider the air driven sponges to be my primary filtration as they oxygenate so air pumps are all that is backed up in my fish rooms. And on very valuable tanks - low stocking rates with auto water change is probably the very best safeguard of them all. If a power outage happens then you don't need to do anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishdance Posted October 31, 2016 Share Posted October 31, 2016 Oh... and a petrol generator that needs to be manually switched on. I prefer manual. Make sure to run it out of petrol when storing between maintenance checks. And if course, another back up generator in case the first fails and rotated supply of fuel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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