side drop design efficiency?

[Donny Brasco]

Hey guys i have done a good lot of searching and found a few different designs for doing side drop filters on all my breeder tanks.
What i would like to know if anyone has the answer as to which one would be more efficient in both filtration and cleaning.

I have attached a picture of the 2 styles im thinking about doing, the one on the left will be a bit more mucking around because 2 lots of glass, but it also seems to be the more common design of the 2.
How ever i believe the second design might be a bit better and keeping a steady flow on the base of the tank to suck up and craP on the bottom of the tank.

Im basically trying to reduce maintenance and increase efficiency as ill be adding another 10 x 4ft tanks to my already 8 x 4ft tanks, so if i can reduce maintenance by not having the gravel vac every week and set up and auto drain and fill system i think this style filter set up may be better than the sponges i have been using.

tanks in question are your typical 4ft breeder 4x14x18, and each tank only had around 8 fish in them (breeding colonys), i will run 2 air lifters to each tank/filter and hoping having the heater in the "sump" will keep temps at bay as well.

Any advice/discussion welcome

[Chuckmeister]

For me I'd still be going for the first design where the water flows over the top.

Firstly, you dont want to be pulling out your bio media as its a real pain. You also dont want to be putting any filter wool or foam on the bottom as you'll be removing your bio media often. The idea for over the top is that your water gets mechanically filtered first through wool or foam and that makes it easy to clean. Just rip the wool out, wash and replace.

I also prefer the longer draw (water) of the bigger uplifts.

You will also need to drill your glass for the uplifts to sit in at the top as this will lock them in place.

Also not sure how you will get a heater in there as usually space is tight.

[Josh]

Number one is tried and tested, it works well.

I agree with Chris about the heater, you will be lucky to have room for one and would be better adding more filter material to use the space better. I would also get rid of the bio filtration and add extra floss.

[Donny Brasco]

oh really thats interesting, does any one have any pics of how they would do it?

[Chuckmeister]

I've got a couple of pics and a vid in my planted tank thread somewhere

[Donny Brasco]

just checked it out then, so you suggest filling up the space with bio noodles and then just some filter floss on top?

I know thats in a planted tank but in a fish stocked tank do you think some of the poop would make its way up into the filter?

[Fisho43]

Hey Donny B. I have been using a similar system for over 30yrs, it was called a whirlpool system back then, it has three chambers, first is a settlement chamber where the water enters via the bottom through a grill (SS mesh) or a piece of under gravel filter pad. It then flows over the top of glass baffle into 2nd chamber which has the filtration media of your choice on the bottom and kept up using an inverted plastic tray then with filter sponge on top and filter floss or fine sponge on top of that. Water then flows under the glass baffle into the third chamber which is the return where you have the air lift and can accomodate the heater. I only ever used cut up drinking straws as filter media back then and some of my tanks ran for over 10yrs without ever having to service the filters, only needing to replace the filter floss and clean the sponge when required. You will still have to syphon the gravel at water changes to remove any buidup of crap as this will always occur regardless of any system you choose. Sorry i can't show pics as i do not know how,

Hope this helps and gives you another option. I have a neighbour who uses this filtration method and some of his tanks have been running for over 20yrs and never been serviced other than changing the floss, note he only ever has had native rainbows in his tanks which are not heavy polluters.

[Chuckmeister]

In breeding tanks I normally make my sidedrops vertically from front to back rather than corners and fill the whole thing with filter wool. Filling them with noodles is a bit of a pain if your worried about how clean (or dirty) the media becomes.They can also go green with algae etc if they are exposed to light. Filter wool is really the simplest way to use them.You just need to pull out 1/3 of your wool and wash or replace it.

There are also Hamburg Matten filters. Old school but still effective. I've never used them but a few people on the forum still do I believe.

[Donny Brasco]

So you just use floss no need for noodles or bio balls or anything you get plenty of bio filtration from just filter floss?

[Chuckmeister]

You do get very good filtration through them including bio loads. I've had some pretty heavy loads on some of my filters and I cant recall ever having any serious problems.

I always have substrate (a cm or 2) in my breeding tanks and also a few rocks which helps with bio loads as well. You really just need to use your head a little when stocking tanks. Usually if the tank looks overstocked it generally is. If its overstocked then your creating a finer line and more maintenance.

Also just keep a test kit handy and occasionally test the water to see where your tanks are at.

[Link2Hell]

Marine Pure spheres in the bottom of the filter chamber for better bacteria levels

in nitrification

first design is the way as you won't have back flush problem with particulates

when you need to change the media

drop the water level to lower than the filter side plate top and then remove the top

layer of material that way any particulates remain in the filter chamber

you can also use foam in varied coarseness with a mat instead of floss as media

[Buccal]

No matter what you use, if water passes through it, you have surface area for beneficial bacteria.

Usually,,,,, the true decision making is deciding or guessing how fast or long will it take till blockage occurs.

Most aquarists would be very surprised at what and minimal bio media can be used and got away with.

But skimping can sometimes mean a little more maintenance and keeping things in check.

Using wool is very fine and tight, so it has more internal extensive amounts of surface area which would make it very powerful.

Wool on the flip side, blocks very easily and vast amounts of bio surface area is lost fast.

But in Chucks case he used Wool with fry, and fry does not have much waiste expulsion, so it hardly clags up,,, so chucks choice works beautifully.

Every situation with a bit of enginuity can be got away with incredible small amounts of fuss.

Similar to what Chuck said "using your head a little when stocking tanks"

[Donny Brasco]

yep ok i think im going to go with that style that chuck posted but im going to use a layer of floss on top, then black foam and then a handfull of seachem marine pure and bio noodles with a gap at the base for where the water is sucked up

*should i put the floss under the bio balls/noodles so it polishes the water last and doesnt clog up and just use the corser black foam for catching all the crap, that way once a week when im doing water change or even every second change i would pull the black foam out and give it a quick squeeze in some old aquarium water.

I think this solves my filter system now just to work on heating, im still trying to work out of i install a heater with ducting and run a thermostat power supply to control the heater or weather i put put individual heaters in every tank, roughly 20x4ft tanks going to be a pain in the buM.

[Chuckmeister]

I used to have these on breeders too but your right, you do have to keep on top of it. I used to buy filter wool in bulk for fairly cheap. Sometimes I'd be stingy or if I was short of it I'd wash it and replace or simply tear out what you think and replace with new stuff. The beauty of custom filters is you can make them as big or small as you like and fill them suiting your needs.

This one is one I was playing around with years ago when I went down the 'I wanna put in bio media' road

Was a 4x3x2 and the filtration on this tank ended up beastly. Its probably more complex than anyone could be bothered with but no harm in showing it

Exactly the same concept as a side drop but just shuffled around a little.

Basically the water got pulled up through the black sponge and would overflow over the top box into the second box of media.

On the side were 4 uplift channels each with an airstone. It would draw the water out over the top as a typical side drop would.I had to put 4 channels is to maintain an aven draw of water.

It was fun playing around with the design and when running it was so simple just to pull that sponge out, rinse and re-install. I had 2 on this tank which was my compromise on losing real estate to over filtration.

The water is dirty because I had just filled it and didn't rinse the Aquaclay.

[mjoconr]

I've used Hamburg Matten filters and they work well. The reason why they are used is because there cheap and very effective. The options your looking at cost more money.

[Chuckmeister]

yeah, if I were ever setting up an air driven fish room again I'd definitely use these in fry tanks